The Year 2009 is quickly coming to an end. As we celebrate the birth of Jesus this December and we reflect on the successes of the year, the sorrows and perhaps our pitfalls, we must remember that Seychelles
Collapse of 2008 Confirmed in 2009
In the early days when I picked up my pen and wrote about the economy and social ills under then SPPF, now P.P. (Parti Le Pep), I was attacked for what I would say. I have been called every name in the book.
I was attacked when I said the Lehman Brothers Bonds were not a sustainable manner to generate cash for Seychelles Seychelles
Since October 31, 2008, the SPPF has changed its name, IMF has entered the picture with a second three (3) year plan that has been signed. Now we have over $69Million in additional debt burden through the IMF and World Bank in just one short year.
This Christmas, ask Mr. President, who signed for those BONDS? Then ask him, who will pay for those Bonds?
A Early Christmas Present For All Seychellois
Paul Mathieu has told us, what President James Michel did not tell us on October 31, 2008: Seychelles
Maybe it is because he was the Minister of Finance all that time, and perhaps he is the person who signed the Bonds in the first place. Or will James Michel tell us that Francis ChangLeng signed the Bonds. Or both of them?
Michel lacked the courage to tell us the truth of the failures of his Party to lead Seychelles
All you old SPUP’s, wake up this Christmas. Open your eyes to the failures of 15 people in your party that led Seychelles Seychelles , send IMF back to Washington and free Seychelles
Deflation or Depression in 2009
In 2009, Seychelles
IMF later adjusted the depression figures from -11% to -8% as a result primarily of the work Alain St. Ange did at STB as Marketing Director, in collaboration with the SHTA that together, came up with a discounting program for room prices in Seychelles to keep in step with world wide discounting.
Now the economy has only -10% arrivals, but -20% receivables. Unemployment was increasing, price of goods remained high, but did not increase by October. Hence, Governor of Central Bank Pierre Laporte said, Inflation was 0%. But that did not mean that goods were cheap. They were not of course. He meant that the Seychelles Rupee has gained incredible strength against the Euro, the most powerful currency in the world, under his leadership at the Central Bank. How does Mr. Laporte do that?
Give Laporte A Little Credit...But...
To his credit, Mr. Laporte stopped hyperinflation which was up to 78% last year, due to the variance of official rate to Black Market Rates and built up a reserve of $100 Million quickly by offering the highest interest rates in the world for Treasury Bills (32%).
This kept the government afloat as they mopped up Seychelles Rupees to keep Government in the cash flow. But because we were in a deflationary economic cycle and the Central Bank did not realize this while it strengthened the Seychelles Rupee against the Euro. At one point, the Euro was trading 1.0- 1.50 to a US Dollar, while it took a Pierre Laporte piano slide in Seychelles
Deflation Cycle Sets In
While Deflation was setting in Seychelles Seychelles
Deflation is a systematic economic cycle that reduces the size of a countries economy through less revenue, which curbs economic activity, reduces demand for hard currency, because people spend less simply because in real terms they have less to spend.
Protracted over a long period of time, it results in lack of demand for growth industries as construction, development, rentals, housing. Property values collapse. Only business that sell commodities required for living remain viable in a deflationary cycle. Pierre Laporte did not tell us this in 2009.
In the shops and warehouses, over extended Deflation, results in the warehouses being overstocked with goods, not because they can get all the foreign exchange to buy everything they want, but because, what they bought in a restocking effort, has not sold. Goods sit on the shelves, and expire, then the goods make their way to the dump site and they never make it to the Christmas table.
Dangers of Deflation
The Deflation cycle is particularly painful for any government to handle let alone its people. Prolonged over a long time, the unemployed lose their skills, fall to drugs, alcohol, and other social ills. This has a compounded effect on society. Programs must be set up to fine tune unemployed skills. Do not leave them to the road side P.P. They are not dead.
If Government ignore this facet of deflation, it results in not merely a collapsing economy, but a collapsing society. In Seychelles
Drugs and Alcohol
Government is hiding these statistics to fool us all, Seychellois, business community FDI players, you name it. All key partners have a mental barrier over these statistics when deliberating national issues. We must wake up, because the failure of Seychelles
Evidence of Collapsing Society
According to CARE, based on its research in schools with students, and a reasonable conclusion is drawn from the data collected, in Seychelles, we have a low figure of 9800 drug- alcohol addicts in Seychelles, and a high figure of 18,000 addicts in Seychelles. 18,000 is about 32% of our population. This is an alarming figure when we treat less then 50 people per year for the addictions.
This simple statistic is a warning to us all. In Seychelles
$100,000.00 Per Head Debt
Perhaps it is time to relook at the Seychelles USA
The policy of seeking out Arab friends in time of financial despair and in turn selling islands and Seychellois heritage for Scr.1.00 is a financial model of destruction.
Face Reality This Christmas P.P.
This Christmas SPPF, P.P. or whatever you will call yourselves next year, do get real. Come up with broad base solutions for Seychelles
Your AK-47’s and rocket launchers that gather dust now, will not be of much use to you this time.
Change your ways or you shall fail...again. This is my Christmas message to you!
A Message To The Opposition
At this time, I call on the Opposition in Seychelles Seychelles
To the NDP, I advise you, that in the effort to oppose, if you lack credibility in leadership, and have not established any depth of organization, then you will become irrelevant in the politics of Seychelles
To Mr. Boulle and his renewed efforts to form a new Party, I welcome your enthusiasm and energy, but you will have to establish a broad base of support, and you can do that by only being democratic in thought exchange of ideas, and pushing a real cause forward, and not necessarily a person.
To the team that just brought in a new 4 colour industrial printing press, to establish an independent press, Congratulations! May you hold true to the ideals of democracy, freedom of press, and justice for all Seychellois. You have done a great service to the future of Seychelles
To all in the Opposition, while the Christmas Season is upon us and the New Year comes, be forewarned that the challenges ahead must be tackled in unity, with the best ideas ruling the day, not the best man or best party. The problems of Seychelles
In the Kingdom of God
In the kingdom of man, knock until you break the door down. Dialogue, communicate, for it is we, who hold the key to set Seychelles
From my family, to yours, a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!
May God Bless Seychelles
Christopher Gill
Thank you so much Mr Gill for your insightful contributions and for christmas greeting as well. As an educated seychellois i would like to wish you and your family the very best for 2010. Like the moto goes fearless in dignity. As an optimist the seychellois people will be free and remember god's timing is perfect no trickery would save PP when the right time comes but every single seychellois has been given a gift from almighty god which is the power of discernment that is to choose between right and wrong. So as you rightly said every seychellois must give a helping hand to remove the cancerous tumour called SPPF which is sending our country to its grave.
ReplyDeleteAs for the opposition I would like to see also a united opposition which has trust,mutual respect and a seychelles first atitude. Opposition must remember that unity is not only words before an election but a commitment which bind parties together to bring about prosperity to all seychellois. I have only one word of advice for SNP if you think you can win an election alone make no mistake because this would be suicidal. My reality for 2010 is to see a united opposition which has love and peace for each other before election and after election for the love of every seychellois citizen. We are fed up of leaders who steal our riches and store in their bank accounts overseas and call themselves patriotic.Leaders whom after being elected pledged to save guard the resources of the seychelles and after sold our resources to Arabs, Russians and South Africans for one ruppee. We do not want leaders who instill fear in our people with guns because they cannot lead a nation. We want a leader who is truthful,god loving and who is satisfied with what he earns and who is willing to respect the property of the nation.
From a great admirer of your intelligence and your sincerity. Keep it up man seychellois with eye in their mind truly appreciate the work that you have been doing at times single handedly.
The signs of an unhealthy economy has been evident for over a decade now and our ruling politicians have been doing what they can to hide it so they can keep on winning elections, a job well done. Our people on the other hand have seen all the signs, but have turned a blind eye to it hoping it will go away like a bad dream.
ReplyDeleteIn addition to Christopher Gill's warnings, several others have given the same warnings, not least anonymous Seychellois like myself and others via forums like STAR and others.
Those doing so have been ridiculed, laughed at and called every name in the book where 'traitor' and 'unpatriotic' have been clear favourites. On the other hand, critics of the then SPPF were hailed by SNP supporters, not due to the fact that they pointed out the economical turmoil tha was coming our way, but more due to the fact that the SPPF was being criticised not giving a care in teh world what for. Today, the same ones who hailed me back then are accusing me of being a PL supporter as I raise questiones about the credibility of Wavel Ramkalawan. There is no winning here.
My Christmas wish is for the people of Seychelles, including its politicians who most still posess a bit of humanity, to open their eyes and see reality for what it is and handle accordingly. We are told that the economy is better, truth judging that it could not possibly get worse, but we are far from being cured despites James Michel's words, speeches and promises. One thing I've learned in my life is to never trust anybody's words when the person is after your vote.
My Christmas wish is for the people of Seychelles to unite for a better Seychelles by putting their selfishness aside and of what's best for Seychelles in the long run. This means for instance thinking twice before that air-con unit is purchased or before you bring on a new car now that the taxes have gone down. It also means making a preference for a fellow Seychellois rather than an expat when considering employment or the contracting of a project. It also means that politicians should set their own ambitions aside and cooperate with oneanother by doing what will put Seychelles first, not what will put certain Seychellois first as the priority is Seychellois in general as a nation.
My Christmas dream is not necessarily to get the PL out of the way, but it is to get whichever useless party out of the way, be it PL, SNP or DP. I strongly believe in a multiparty system with a ruling party and opposing parties, not a single opposing party. My christmas wish is for any opposing party to vote against what they believe is wrong, but also to vote for what they believe is right, even if it is the idea of the ruling party. Why? Because it means that they are putting Seychelles first.
cont...
My Christmas wish is for the government and general public to fight harder against drugs and its devastation to our society. My dream is for every Seychellois to practice a zero-tolerance policy towards illegal narcotics and not tolerance for certain groups, but not for others. By doing so we will be setting an example to others and hopefully one day drugs will be something of the past. We are surrounded by ocean and the only other entry to our country is through an airport so how difficult can it be to stop the drug flow to Seychelles?
ReplyDeleteMy Christmas dream is for Seychellois to show tolerance and understanding towards oneanother despite political opinion. We already show those gestures when it comes to race and religion so why not politics? Why can a PL not respect an SNP or vice versa? And why is it so had to understand that a minor group may be right in their sayings?
Others have done it before and I sincerely believe we can. I do not in any way wish to get rid of any party as many here say, but I do wish to have the best party for Seychelles ruling be that party socialist, democrat or whichever ideology it have that may be best for Seychelles. We are after all unique, maybe not by a thousand miles, but defintely have a uniqueness that needs unique solutions. Let us find those together.
Merry Xmas to all
Patrick X
Reply To Patrick X
ReplyDeleteYour ID is irrelevant. It is your ideas that matter if they are good ones. Bad ideas only add to the morass we live in that has your support from time to time.
Threatening to put everyone in a "sak gouni" and tossing the, I suspect is a little like the murder of Damantra Elutien and is not a thought I would advocate on the blog.
However, you are free to express your violent nature in words. Star will publish and let the world know what P.P. the party running Seychelles is like.
Damantra, if you will recall was recently found submerged, in the ocean by a fisherman collecting traps.
His body was mutilated, a chain and engine block tied around his neck, an eye missing, and castrated. His body had multiple stabs to it, neck was cut.
There is plently of evidence of/ on this murder, but no prosecution. Culprits suspects, were only moved from State House to the army base up the street.
It only shows us, and the world, what SPPF P.P. Patri Le Pep are like after you scratch the surface of cover ups.
I pray for you Patrick X, I pray for all Seychellois that use violence to resolve economic issues and national bankruptcy. It is the wrong tool for the job.
Continue hiding in 2010 if you wish Patrick, at least under disguise, you can say what you want.
I am honored to assist you in the name of Free Speech.
Christopher Gill
Reply To Patrick X
ReplyDeleteYour ID is irrelevant. It is your ideas that matter if they are good ones. Bad ideas only add to the morass we live in that has your support from time to time.
Threatening to put everyone in a "sak gouni" and tossing the, I suspect is a little like the murder of Damantra Elutien and is not a thought I would advocate on the blog.
However, you are free to express your violent nature in words. Star will publish and let the world know what P.P. the party running Seychelles is like.
Damantra, if you will recall was recently found submerged, in the ocean by a fisherman collecting traps.
His body was mutilated, a chain and engine block tied around his neck, an eye missing, and castrated. His body had multiple stabs to it, neck was cut.
There is plently of evidence of/ on this murder, but no prosecution. Culprits suspects, were only moved from State House to the army base up the street.
It only shows us, and the world, what SPPF P.P. Patri Le Pep are like after you scratch the surface of cover ups.
I pray for you Patrick X, I pray for all Seychellois that use violence to resolve economic issues and national bankruptcy. It is the wrong tool for the job.
Continue hiding in 2010 if you wish Patrick, at least under disguise, you can say what you want.
I am honored to assist you in the name of Free Speech.
Christopher Gill
Chris, the 'sak gouni' statement had no violent thoughts whatsoever, just a mere expression I heard from a loved late relative about another who was a master of playing tricks on others.
ReplyDeleteMy point is that here online I can lure you all to believe that I am any person I want you to believe, yes even France Albert Rene himself. Everybody is speculating more on my ID rather than reading what I write, analyze it and come with caounter-debate. Apart froma handful of you here, the remainder have all accused me of being everything from a murderer, thief, conman and other similar things. I don't expect everyone to accept everything I say blindly, but I do expect those of you with intelleigence to counterdebate me and question my sayings in an adult manner, not least debative manner. So far there has been little debate, mere accusations and attacks.Thing is, if I really was PL supporter I'd be damn proud of it and wouldn't be the least afraid of showing that I was. So I really don't see why you all think I am.
I remember Damantra and the horrible pictures that were published on Seychelles media(I believe LNSW got permission from his family to post those hoping that it would clear the case). Now who is/was responsible for his death I can only speculate about like most Seychellois and had the murder happened in the time of France Albert Rene I would be in no doubt about who is responsible, but would find it strange that he didn't dispose of the body so nobody would find it as he usually did. I can't remember all the details around the case as the speculations were many, but I do remmeber that my first thought was that he'd probably encountered some drug smugglers and had to meet his fate. I think that because only a sick person or persons can do such attrocities to a fellow human. Either that or a person on drugs living in a world of his own.
I do believe that there are fractions of the SPDF and/or other organs in statal or parastatal organisations that have let the power they have been given to go to their heads. This has happened many times in history, amongst the most known the two knights who killed Thomas Becket so don't be surprized if one day you find that similar has happened. What I do find strange is that James MIchel would order such a killing as a simple disappearance would have been so much easier and cleaner.
But I do know very well what the SPUP/SPPF/PL consist of. I have kin who left the most high post in pure disgust of the ongoings back then(time of Rene) and there is no doubt that a lot of these things still go on today.
As to continuing hiding in 2010 I cannot say that I feel that I am hiding, merely using a cover to make this site interesting and drag more bloggers to it so that we can all contribute to many a good debate and hopefully collect some good ideas for the future.
But me a PL? I still think that they are the better option, but far from any good in many ways. Competent? Not a single bit! Smart? Absolutely, the type who can use my 'sak gouni' strategy. Get some of those in your camp and you can compete with PL.
Patrick X
ReplyDeletePatrick-
ReplyDeleteYour sak gouni strategy sounds like "STRATEZI 2017", however, you are free to do what makes you feel good about yourself.
But please remember, the People of Seychelles are about to start undergoing great pain and suffering, that will last for many, many years, under P.P.
Our Children will pay greatly Patrick.
I wish you great courage.
Happy New Year!
Christopher Gill
Stratezi 2017 gave the people no choice of entering the 'sak gouni', neither did taking up loans that we possibly could not pay back, nor did bringing in Irish retirees to run our police force etc. And why did the people not have any choice there?
ReplyDeleteFirst of all because the PL has been allowed to venture and do as as they please as the one supposed to make sure that nobody gets put in a 'sak gouni' has failed the people including his own supporters by allowing James Michel & Co to do as they please and in most cases not even bother to attend meetings he was invited to as the invitation did not come on a silver plate.
Second of all, the people have had no choice as they too easily shrug up their shoulders and say 'be ou kapab lager ek sa?'. This includes members of the opposition themselves who can't even be bothered to take up a fight with their own leader who has balls the size of peanuts.
Now SPPF as they were known as when Strategy 2017 was launched had a strategy, however much it resembled a 'sak gouni'. The opposition, including DP had none whatsoever, let alone a manifest that held water. Now if you were desperate for a solution, which one would you follow? The one with a bad strategy or the one without any strategy?
With that I hope you see my point regarding the now famous 'sak gouni'. With words you can fool or convince anyone you want. Fooling is easy when the listeners are desperate or do not know any better. Those kind of voters are easily convinced.
Now think of the Seychellois who consist of a very young population whom many do not know any better than having the SPPF/PL in charge. Ar they easily fooled to think that the PL is the only option? I think we both agree on that. Are these desperate for a solution? A definete yes. And will those follow whoever tells them that 'tou ketsos pou an ord'? I think the result of the last election speaks for itself there.
Now you have to ask yourself what you have to do to get those same voters to enter your 'sak gouni'. It may sound brutal and primitive, but politics is no game, especially when so much is at stake and the PL will do whatever they can to clinch onto power. And as said before, the 2011 election is already a PL victory so you'll have to aim for the next one together with an eventual united OP and other parties that may come out of the woodwork from 2010 and on. It is however imnportant to participate in the 2011 show for several reasons:
- To show that you exist
- To prove that you're serious
- To freak out the PL
Words do not gain respect unless they are implemented with proceeding action.
I believe you've seen my point now and I can summarize by comparing Seychelles(as a nation) with a typical battered wife:
She is sick of the beating and desperately wants change, but keeps on going back the the man who smacks her time after time despite promises of change. Why?
I'll leave the answer for you guys to speculate and look forward to debating it. I believe that when we've found some good answers the the question above, we can work out a strategy.
Patrick X
Why does not Patrick X do something for Seychelles. He is smart and is convinced that he has the best ideas.
ReplyDeleteInstead he uses his intelligence to keep PL where it is to prolong the suffering?
He will not even use his name.
Yet, he blames others for not coming forward.That is not right. Where is your spine as a man Patrick X? Or are you a woman?
To me it does not matter, but it would matter if you used your name.
Anne
There is no doubt that patric X is a smart ass as he once put it. What is surprising is that his first blog was aimed at setting a so call trap for Chris.(His own admision) He later confirmed that chris did fall into it. After that, nowhere in his contribution has he shown a true willingness to be part of the side that want to make the change. He has mostly shown that he is well informed of the political circumstances and what he think is the better evil.
ReplyDeleteIt will be beneficial if he could be more involved in helping to formulate solution than picking all the issues that will cause the other side to open up so that he or PL for that matter will have their enemies close. I think his/her strategy is to keep abreast with what is going on in the other camp through setting some agendas or suggesting certain way of thinking. As good as some of what he say is, one should be careful, because i feel he shows strong tendencies of a strategist with ulterior motives and not necesarily giving the other side ideas for good reason other than to choke themsleves.(the so call trap or " sak gouni"
I may be wrong but so far based on what has been written in here, the posibility is real.
J.
Hey J, may you enlighten as who/which party wants to make a change in Seychelles?
ReplyDeleteVox Dei
To Anne:
ReplyDeleteI believe I am doing a lot for Seychelles, more than many Seychellois sitting on their butts with a Guiness in their hands solving all political issues from a roadside location four steps from the local Indian store.
As to my idea being the best I do not necessarily agree as there is no definite correct answer, but many. Which one is best is however another question, one that will be asked in 2011, 2016 and every five years on.
I do however know that many of my ideas are good, very good indeed as I have through my lifetime of travels and experience abroad learned how things can be done in addition to their advantages and drawbacks. Yes, even the best and most ideal ideas have drawbacks.
Anne, I am not in any way trying to keep PL wherer they are. If it was up to me I'd change the whole bloody lot of those useless twats, from the so-called minister of finance who's eyes are about to pop out of their socket to the prezident himself who despite making an effort after taking over a messsed up country is just another one of the old school who has too many skeletons in his closet. Unfortunately as I've said on numerous accounts, the PL are the better of two evils at this moment in our political history. Sorry to say this, but as I said in another thread: I'd rather keep my disease that cure it and acquire numerous unknown side effects in the process.
I do not however blame others for not coming forward. That I do not agree with you Anne. Now you blame me for not coming forward, but what about yourself? Who are you mor than merely 'Anne'? Why is it ok for some to come out and not others? Is that not the same type of 'animal farm' attitude that the SPUP/SPPF/PL is known for? ;-)
I'll reply 'J.' later, have to pop out a bit now, wife's nagging me to hurry up.
Patrick X
Vox, i was not refereing to a specific party, but to people with the potential to do so, whenever that may be. I am sure you know the saying " keep your friends close and your enemies closer"
ReplyDeleteIf Patrick X is not what I am sensing he is and that he would rather see a better 'group' managing seychelles affairs for the benefit of all seychellois as we all want to see, then I hope that he will be one of those who will become instrumental in helping that process. Currently that process is not really being helped except for the creation of this 'guess who I am' kind of game and a show of his seychelles politics knowledge. Like i said before, there is no doubt that you have plenty of knowledge in that sense. We are also very clear that you are on the fence. (However, leaning to the better evil as you put it). So patrick when will your political knowledge be more useful to those who wants to see a better seychelles?
I do not have the analytical skills (politically) as you seem to have so i cannot do much in that sense, therefore i am suggesting that you use yours to help the cause more, even if its early in the process.That is if you are the opposit of what i said in my first blog.
J.
I'm back so now to J's posts:
ReplyDeleteJ, my first blog, the trap for Chris, had one sole goal and I believe that it was reached. It was meant as an eye-opener to Chris and the rest of those on the opposite side of the political fence to realize that in order to have a chance whatsoever to make any progress, one has to keep a professional and mature level of debate and critism. It happened as Chris changed his attitude and as he himself said, the amount of visitors to the site increased remarkably in short time. STAR is no longer Chris Gill's personal little soap box as it was before, it is now what I'd classify as a good political blog site.
With that said, I believe it can get better and should do so too. No, I'm not taking credit for it before I get accused of doing so. I believe that Chris should get the credit for first taking the critism in a constructive way and to all others here who have contributed in a proper manner to make the site better. Chances are it could have ended in a pure shit-throwing contest like many other sites, but it didn't and that itself means that those blogging here are decent people who want the best for Seychelles.
As to how well informed I am, I can reveal that my sources are available to all of you if you are only willing to open your eyes and take away those filters that too blind you from seeing in all colours of the spectre. We are a small nation and in many ways too narrow minded in addition to many of us being brought up to see only certain colours. Being a small nation we are also a loyal people to our family, friends and not least employers. The mentioned also expect the same loyalt from us so it is indeed difficult to even dare look over the fence, let alone jumping it.
You mention that you are not sure of my motives and that I want to 'choke' the other side by getting them in my 'sak gouni'. Isn't it however every politician's ambition to get people in his/her 'sak gouni' either for the purpose of politically imprisoning them, gathering and raising them or in worse cases to drown them? Ramkalawan gathered and politically imprisoned almost 50% of the Seychellois. They were in his 'sak gouni', but somewhere along the way he got sick of dragging it around and slung it in the roadside where it was picked up by James Michel who emptied the contents to his own 'sak gouni'. My intention? To gather and raise, the same every politician wants to do. What good would it do me if I were to dump you 'dan lakre'? I'd get rid of an opponent maybe, but then again where would the democracy be and what joy would it be of winning if I was the sole contestant like France Albert Rene did his so-called elections? Besides, I don't need to put you all in any 'sak gouni' to dump you in the ocean, you're aleready doing a great job on your own. You even have huge rocks in your 'sak' where the biggest one is Ramkalawan.
cont......
cont......
ReplyDeleteAs to wether my politcal knowledge coming to use in Seychelles, nothing would please me more by doing so, but I am too honest of character to ever become a politician and I dare say I am a terrible arse-kisser hence lack the diplomatic ability it takes to become a politician, especially in a place like Seychelles. I'm a good adviser, i.e a consultant, and that is where I want to stay too. To me making something happen through advise is more important than making them happen through force although the latter has to take place sometimes. Now as an adviser, I will give advise to whoever asks for it and will naturally give the advise that the country will benefit from in the long term, not the advise that will fill my pocket most. I have a conscience and integrity, the same types my kin kept the day he resigned in disgust of the ongoings within the then SPUP regime. There is a lot to say about X who left a career many dream of, but if there is something I am proud of him about it's the fact that he left in order to keep his conscience and integrity. That's how I am and that's how I intend to stay. Now is there a controversy in me saying that and at the same time saying that I would vote for the better evil? I don't think so because I put Seychelles frst by choosing the option I feel is best.
I would be delighted to help the cause, but when it comes to analytical skills I think you should look elsewhere. My skills are pure instinctive and psychological. My speciality is making order out of chaos and I'm damn good at it. What the opposityion parties have now is chaos and lots of it. I cannot say the saem for the PL and that J, is the opposition's 'malediksyon'. Until there is order in SNP and DP the PL will prevail again and again and again.
My best advise to you all to start with is making a list of 20 things the PL has that the opposition does not have. When you have such a list, for every point you can write down 3 things you can do to get the same. For those things you simply cannot get(e.g funds, time on SBC etc) you must make balance in other points, for instance stronger participation at the grassroots, attend every 'miting konsiltatif' etc.
Get my drift?
Patrick X
Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteYou are in overdrive and the New Year has not started yet.
Since you have accepted the Star blog as mainstream sensible, I would like to extend an open invitation to Ramkalawan, Volcere, Boulle, Mancham, Michel(opps, he is Head of State-out for now)to comment and contribute to what is being said on this sight.
I also invite all MNA's to comment with their names, freely.
Democracy is about participation, I offer it to all parties involved in issues that face Seychelles.
Those that take the opportunity, will be recognized for it. Those that do not, will leave their public responsibility to the road side and will have to defend their inaction.
In 2010- letscrank Star to 50,000 visits since 15,000 is a no brainer.
Christopher Gill
Me in overdrive? 'You ain't see nothin yet' as a famous American used to say! ;-) You know which one?
ReplyDeleteBut back to the theme here. Chris, there is no need to dish out invitations to STAR, those who want to participate will do so either in pseudo or in real life. I must however say that I believe it would be better if all remained psuedo. Can you imagine all the shit-throwing you'd have here if the invitees were to appear with their real names? I can just see it before my eyes. Besides, don't we have a brand new assembly building where political discussions are supposed to take place?
But regarding MNAs and their contact with the public I suggest the following for all parties:
Have an open transparent page online that publishes all letters and contact with the MNAs in addition to their official reply to those letters, e-mails etc. An official page can be made by each respective party which is dedicated to queries, questions and answers not least follow ups. That I believe would be a more appropriate and neutral way of doing things. What do you think?
There is however no way in hell that any politician from neither PL or SNP will stand out here on STAR with his/her full name. It would be most unprofessional and pure suicide. Not because the site is not serious, on the contrary, but it's not an official site and from its name it certainly is not a neutral one. Apart from that, do you seriously expect a PL MNA to participate in an online debate with someone who refers to their pary as PP(Peepee)?
Patrick X
By the way, it's not the amount of visitors which makes a site good. It's the content. Somethign about quality and quantity.
ReplyDeleteI think you'll find you agree although 15.000 visitors/bloggers is a good score, but again, who are those visitors? Those who are 100% anti PL? If so then I'd say aim to attract those who are 100% PL. It's their votes you need, the other ones you alreday have.
Patrick X
Reply to X
ReplyDeleteYou are a master at sophistry.
But I see through you.I disagree with your premise.
The invitation to public figures to post a comment and engage in dialogue without hiding behind fake names if done, would be a serious advancement to democracy in Seychelles in cyber time.
It is the one thing P.P. are afraid of. Why?
Because if people start using names with comments, it means the era of fear is ending. This era of fear must be led by politicians.
They are paid public servants, they carry the banner officially for change.
One of my great surprises behind this blog effort is that politians hide. They fear engagement, because they fear accountability.
Except for Wavel Ramkalawan, no one else has left comments with there names.
In fact, he challenged Patrick X to use his name and Vox aswell.
I believe the challenge should not be towards Vox or Patrick X, I assuume they are citizens. The challenge should be to politicians that are paid a fat salary to thrash out the politics of the day.
The Quality / Quantity argument is not placed well. We are not calling for a sacrifice of Quality in arguments, we are calling for an increase in Quality through increase in Quantity.
We know that not all visitors leave comments , but study and absorb what is being written on STAR. Average visits are pushing 4.0 minutes.
But the end and short of it is that STAR access has no boundaries. What is written is shapes ideas that lead the politics of Seychelles and the perception of our realities around the world, including Seychelles.
Only P.P. try to work their way around that, by making character assassination attempts on the opposition. The People paper, front ppage last week, "Koste" , with pictures of some key opposition people, in the form of christmas balls, apparently decorating a P.P. tree is that type of symbolism at work to effect character assassination.
The obvious attempt to paint the Opposition players in a light supportive of P.P. is an attempt to divide the Opposition.
In the final say Patrick X- there is nothing more liberating then placing your name to your thoughts.
Those that cannot do it, we protect them,until they can.
But a politician that cannot do it, does not belong in politics.
They are wasting our money. If they do not have our money, when they do, they will steal it.
We need performance and accountability to change our reality!
Christopher Gill
Mr Gill i must have missed the posting by Mr Ramkalawan or his challenge to post names. Kindly point out to me the posting.
ReplyDeleteNow i would not trust Wavel Ramkalawan since he has a history of putting his supporters in harms way. Some years ago despite being warned by a few people Ramkalawan hired a known SPPF spy as his bodyguard. This bodyguard was tasked with collecting money from supporters. This bodyguard then gave those names to Danny Faure, the person in charge of intelligence in the SPPF. Some of those supporters were later targetted by the SPPF for special victimisation.I have been critical to both Ramkalwan and SPPF/PL.
FEAR is an unfortunately an integral part of Seychelles politics. I am as much scared of some Opposition politicians as the SPPF/PL machinery. Ramkalawan has a history of violence; he violently attacked an SPPF MNA Barry Faure and a few other SPPF/PL supporters. SPPF/PL violence towards opponents are well documented. They are as ruthless as can be.
My point is that we should start a democratic culture within the Opposition itself first which would then permeate to Seychelles as a whole. Comments from Mr Ramkalawan to his Excutive Committe that they could all go to hell (as reported in the Indian Ocean Newsletter) is very alarming and sad and certainly is not a culture which should be encouraged within a democracy!
Now unless and until people feel secure in expressing their opinion, people will not come forward. I do not have a USA passport as Mr Gill, i am not a politician. I am a citizen grateful for the fact that people like Mr Gill has created an environment which allows me regularly to voice my opinion.
I dream of the day when Seychelois will be able to voice their opinion without being subject to aggravations. The politicians can help make this happen.
Vox Dei
I reply to Vox
ReplyDeleteCheck the comments section on past articles in early October. Before SNP rally in town.
You will find the comments by Wavel Ramkalawan.I quote off cuff-"show your real name and who you are stop hiding".
I do not defend Ramkalawan. If what is said in ION is true, then it is damning on him not as a politician alone, but as a Preist as well. Personally, I believe he should defend himself.But that is my opinion, and my style, not his.
Ramkalawan might ignore you, until you take his gratuity and car.That is more his style,in my opinion.
The problems you highlight over body guards, violence etc.... are well known by myself. But again, this is a matter for the SNP to deal with.
I am not SNP, but I have had similar issues when on Executive Committee of DP. I was tossed out, lived beyond that, and today, enjoy a very positive relationship with Mancham and DP. I have written in Weekly for some time, and now write in prestigous Review, that handles issues on a national level.
I even post as a reporter for Review at times on critical public interest issues to get the word right. I do that for free of any money, just to help Seychelles.
The point is that we must learn to overcome obstacles and face them with courage and dignity. To just raise our hands in the air and give up is not human.
Most immediate issue of concern to Public is fat salaries of MNA and Lo. SNP should have never,never taken that money -salary increase of 38% and as much as Scr.840,000.00 bonus- gratuity for the LO Ramkalawan and Ministers-SPPF , when people are suffering so much and will be asked to suffer so much more in the future.
This Wavel Ramkalawan will not escape history if he and SNP does not give this money back.
I will write about that in the New Year, extensively, unless there is action by SNP and P.P. on this unjustifiable pay-hike. I have already advised him Ramkalawan that he must give back 25% of that money, along with SNP MNA's.
Correct the mistake, before it is too late.
This issue is enough grounds for any serious party to reshuffle itself both P.P. and SNP
The USA passport Vox, will not stop communist thugs from using a bullet on my creole ass.
Happy New Year Vox!
Christopher Gill
Dear Patrick X
ReplyDeleteI have to admit that i have gone through most of your comments which i could say have substance. But what i do not personally appreciate in some of your comments are your persistant attack on the SNP leadership but you have rarely attack Albert Rene for what he has been doing with the esychellois people. What i have seen are some half hearted and flimsy attack on the the PL? And after that you have told us that you would choose the better devil. I can honestly tell you that there is no better devil if it does exist it is only as a metaphor. You can be good or evil there is no half way. Having said that i would like to tell you that making veil assumptions that SNP could not make a better seychelles is a mere fanatasy because the SNP structure is not dictated by one man it is a team and you know that in human relationship internal rife would happen but wise man would turn these negativity into positivity which i would hope would make a party heaithier. Please remember that Mr Ramkalawan had no part in messing up the seychelles and to my knowledge he had never been a minister or a high profile leader in the SPPF government. Not even the president of the seychelles for that matter. Please stop playing the devil's advocate because we know from your own comments that you resent change. So on that note i would be very grateful to share a few quotes with you. Any fool can critize, complain and condemn- and most fool do. But it takes character and self control to be understanding and forgiving. A great man shows his greatness by the way he threats little man. So please you might not be in agreement with the SNP leadership but respect this man as a good christian whom i think you are. Remember that SPPF won previous elections not because they had better strategies than the opposition because they have defied all the democratic norms to ensure that they stay in power because the international community is not interested with the plight of the seychellois. I can give you a specific example after the first democratic election the international community asked that there is a delinking between the SPPF and the district administration to this day this has not happened. Why because it is a powerful political tool for spying , punish, threathen and control the little man. So telling us to look for ten evil ways that SPPF/PL is doing that opposition is not doing is frivolous and ludicrous. Because even if we know ten ways or a million ways the SPPF would make sure that the playing field would never be levelled so that their trickery and deceptions would always prevail. So i would like to share with you what i once told my colleague at work. This was what she told me< Do you think that changing a political party would effect change in the life of the seychellois people> I responded a big no. And this is what i said< It is not the political party that needs to be changed. What needs to be changed is the mindset of the seychellois people>
First they need to konw that it is not a group of cronies who hold the government but the seychellois people.
Secondly it is not the SPPF and the army that hold power in the seychelles but the seychellois people.
Thirdly it is their democratic right to choose their own leader and their choice of leadership through the ballot box is sacred. It cannot be bought for a promise of a house, building materials, a bottle of baka or a take away.
Fourthly fear and intidimation can be easily overcome in the ballot box without spilling a drop of blood.
So i think my contribution on this blog is to try and educate other seychellois who are living in fear to overcome this fear which the SPPF have indotrinated in us so that we can together as a nation break these shackles. So i hope you would join the like of Mr Gill, Mr Ramkalawan and all the other bloggers to achieve that before 2011. It is a tall order but it is achievable.
From Seychellois who refused to be called a selselwa ordinaire.
My a seychellois.
You're all a bunch of dreamers if you think you can win prior to the 2011 election. I can tell you right now that you can forget it, but you have to participate for the reasons I've posted further up here.
ReplyDeleteI'm told that I criticize the SNP only and not France Albert Rene. Well, I frankly don't see the point of bringing up agin and again and again as we all know what he was good for and what state he left he left the country in after pulling out and leaving the mess for James Michel to clean up.
While we're in the subject of France Albert Rene, his rotten party and his deeds, those didn't seem to to bother Christopher Gill when he crossed the floor during assembly in 1997/1998 when the DP ditched him now did it? That's another story for another blog, but nevertheless worth mentioning.
I've now been told that I resent change, but if you read my post and analyze it instead of just reading my critism of the SNP you will see that I am 100% for change and by saying that I am for change for the better, not for the worse. I'm afraid though that Ramkalawan will be a change for the worse. Sorry to disappoint you all, but that is a fact and until a worthy leader can come out front and be a front figure worth voting for I don't see any point of giving my vote to SNP.
As to changing the mindset of the Seychellois people you can forget that. People need to be led and sorry to say this, but our country consists of a good percentage of ignorants, good for nothings and people with a rather primitive way of thinking. Maybe in a few generations, I'm talking about 30-50 years we will have developed further, but mark my words when I tell you that the majority of Seychellois think like Africans, i.e they live for today, today and today only. Tomorrow is another worry which will be dealt with there and then. So don't expect too much in your promises of change for the better in the future. It's what you can do tody that counts for the majority be it a few free beers, amortization of a loan or whatever the man can feel with his hands and see with his eyes. Getting a nation of kankan-tellers to analyze and see the wrongdoings of a corrupt party like the PL is like trying to make the pope believe that Jesus' resurrection is a load of bull written centuries after his death.
If you want open debate, have it on SBC inbetween some cheap shite Telenovela where the people sit clenched at fixed times. Use Nation for what it's worth and the letter to the editor section. Nation is read by all, those piece of shit called Regar, Weekly are read by non PL's. You have to hit the PL in a place where they have to hit back, i.e right in the face. They will otherwise use their most common weapon: Not replying to queries, hence frustrating you and stressing you.
As to who I am? I can tell you that I am neither a minister, I am not an MNA or any politician of any kind. I am a citizen, but not a resident and havn't been for the last 28 years. As to my name you can keep on guessing, but I can reveal that I'm a man in my mid 30s.
Surprized? Remember that 'sak gouni'?
Patrick X
ReplyDeleteDear Patrick!
ReplyDeleteGetting us to use the SPPF mouth piece is a joke because i personally think that this blog is for people with sincerity . principle and hope. Not for people who is pessimististic. I think that your contribution to the Nation would stand a better chance for being published since your sak gouni threory has certain resemblance to the SPPF ideology. We put everybody in the famous sak gouni and then we rape the country of all it resources so that our family and cronies can live happily ever after with their ill gotten riches.
Remember the karmic law which states that you reap what you sow.
Even if you think that you are fooling everybody on this site by playing the devil's advocate. You should know that from your communication a lot can be said about you. Bloggers should forget your identity since you have already reveal a lot about you from the stroke of your keyboard.
From a seychellois
To a Seychellois:
ReplyDeleteMy entire point is that behind my keyboard I have led you all to think that I am a well-informed Seychellois top politician or top government official from the PL camp. And it worked.
The whole point is about the power to convince people. All you need is a bit of information, preparation and the ability to write(or speak) in a sensible and adult way without teeing to childish 9th grade mentality. It also helps to show a bit of calmness and stability.
Sorry to say this, but so far none of the could be parties of a united opposition have any of the above qualities or any quality at all for that matter.
And you still think you can throw out PL in 2011? This is what you can offer Seychelles:
SNP: A bad tempered, aggressive and self-digging priest who has publically said that he is happy he hasn't won an election.
DP: A pouting useless big baby who said a few months ago that he was going to go for gold but has been silent as gold since.
Gill: An unstable big mouthed troublemaker thrown out of DP, joined SPPF only to leave again after not striking gold there only to start his own party and now ventures as a maverick writing blogs worthy of a 9th grader(he has however improved greatly the last month or so).
Boulle: God knows what he's up to, but is supposedly also going to try his luck again.
Let us say the lot of you did unite and aimed for the top and you managed to create a united opposition. Even then you'd never be able to even agree on who wouyld lead as prezident let alone who would get which ministerial posts. For that you need a plan and a strategy which you don't have today only a mere year before the election campaign goes to 3rd gear(it's already been in first and second a while now).
As the the 'sak gouni', I believe each on of you has it own and until you all decide to share the same 'sak gouni', one with enough room for the PL, the only thing you're going to get in your sacks is your 'grenn'.
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteWhat a prophet of doom you have been after congratulating Mr Gill one day and insulted him the other day?
I am afraid to tell you that this attitude of propagating confusion and deception is the hallmark of SPPF.
Thank for letting us know that the only party with a tangible plan is SPPF. Only fools like you who is psychologically blind could not see the results of their master plan engineer by the self proclaimed great architect of embezzlement,nepotism, corruption, deception, lies and disgracing the highest office in the land by promisciuty. Donot forget one of his best track record is a failing economy and massive debt burden on the poor seychellois where the great majority of us donot have the mean to travel as far as silhouette. Remember sometime back he was the great captian even before the we had so called own tanker. So what a master plan this has been for the seychellois people? I think the current president deserve another medal for that because he was the second in command in the designing of such wonderful plan.
So prophet of doom just give us a break. Trying to spread your evil plan to confuse our bloggers will not work and will never work because most of us on this blog were not educated in communist countries.
Before the new year get your mental state checked by a clinical psychologist because 2010 will be hard when the JJ spirit is excorcised from the seychelles.
From a seychellois
Reply to X
ReplyDeleteThere you go again Patrick, under pressure, when honest people crack you, you attack them personally.
SNP is the lead party in the Opposition, whatever its short comings, it has opposed for many years in a restrictive environment.
Ramkalawan may have his faults, but at least he did not burn the town when you hit him ove rthe head with a night stick.
DP- has been at the forefront of bringing you key information thru Weekly Review. Without it, your information bas eon seychelles reality would be negligible.
Both parties are not perfect. But they oppose communists.
Crossing the Floor Patrick- is a little like your sak gouni I put SPPF in. When Rene sent thugs to my house and with ak 47 and scared the hell out of me, manipulated the fear factor over me, I found a way out. I have explained that many times but do so again to clear your mind which was in its 60's not long ago, and now has turned 30's. You are a dishonest person intellectually, even if you are a ghost writer.
Boulle- is the lawyer for the offshore comapny that just made Government of Seychelles FIU based at State House, cough up over $10 Million Dollars. I would not dismiss Boulle as irrelevant. For you to do so is testament to you living a dream like world of failure.
If you think our writing is 9th grade level, you dream again. I recently had meetings with an ADB PHD and gave him advise on Seychelles predicamnet. It will result in ADB assisting Seychelles in a water catchment capacity projects, not prawn farms. He thanked me for the advise.
Reference to "Big Mouth". You are a typical communist that confuses assertiveness and willfulness with arrogance hence reference to Big Mouth, when in fact I say little in public, and only write. You curb my free speech before I even say a thing. You are desparate Patrick, and it shows.You live outside of Seychelles, only when the inofrmation given is too much for you to handle, then you need me to brief you. SAD.
Grow out of your immature sak gouni Patrick. The problems we face are real my friend.
Your solutions are already the DNA of our problems and our failure as a Nation.Hence the failure of your intellectual posture.
Finally, if a Seychellois has achieved a higher level of education respect him for it. We all come from humble beginings and even our President Mr. Michel, has no education and was not born with a BMW. In the early days, he made it to town on a bike, then a scooter he scammed at Hotel De Seychelles to deliver mail in Victoria.
The BMW of course, we the people pay for.I do not know what happen to the scooter. Perhaps Mr. President can advise us.
Christopher Gill
Patrick X
ReplyDeleteThis person says we are all a "bunch of dreamers".
In communist doctrine, in which lays the belly of his orientation, dreaming is highly discouraged.
Comformity to failure is highly encouraged.
But Patrick X- in free thinking society, the dreamer is reverred for it is he that sees the picture of the future, and it is he that makes the dreams come true, not some putz parasite that lives off the toil of hard working people that props P.P. in power.
I dreamt one day to have an education. I did not stop at one degree, I stopped at 2 at 23.
I dreamed of returning to Seychelles one day. I did not wait for April 12th to return. I returned 2 months before.
I dreamed that one day my writngs will not be censored by a lackey trying to make money off my ideas through extortion, the dream has come true. I am free!
We all dream, and we must keep on dreaming. You Patrick X could not wipe dog shit off Martin Luther Kings left shoe.
Now you communist misfits that follow Patrick X perverted logic thought Rene was so smart, and Michel is a leader and Grand Master, lick your wounds and drink till you drop to the road side tonight, as you reflect on the great failures P.P. SPPF SPUP have brought upon Seychelles and also reflect on the pains of 2009 and double them in 2010 under P.P..
Happy New Year all Freedom Loving Seychellois!
Christopher Gill
I believe that one thing which very unfortunate when it comes to ALL politicians in Seychelles is that very little differentiate them from each other except that they oppose each other. When we look at the Mr Rene, Michel and Ramkalawan on democracy they behave in exactly the same way with regards to the power which they yield (nationally and within their internal party structure). Just a little observation is that both SPPF/PL and SNP run election for party leadership with only ONE candidate.
ReplyDeleteFrankly i consider that fact as evidence that there is no democracy at all within those parties, and find it inconceivable that only one person considers him fit to be the leader. In reality SPPF/PL and SNP are rigged in favour of Albert Rene, James Michel or Wavel Ramkalawan.
Mr Gill has intimated that he is considering having his own political party. I do not know what type of leadership he has in mind (i hope however that it is democracy and freedom of speech he has on his agenda). I consider that a lot of the criticism of Partick X vis a vis the Opposition is interesting and contains many truths.
As Opposition supporters i believe we should seek to correct the imperfections that is in our leaders and parties. It is unacceptable that we admit that X,Y,Z Opposition Leader has many faults witout seeking to correct these.
I believe sincerely that for the Opposition to win any election in Seychelles, the Leaders/parties should be near as perfection as possible (with regards to democracy) in their actions.
We cannot be satisfied with only opposing the SPPF/PL. We must remove the SPPF/PL from power for Seychelles to be able to move forward. Nothing short of that would do justice to our children.
Thanking Mr Gill and his STAR team well for putting in place this blog and allowing free speech and all bloggers and freedom lovers a happy new year.
I pray that our political leaders, especially the Opposition show some wisdom and live by democratic rules without which the fight is worth nothing, put away petty differences, unite and do the right thing by the Seychelles and its people!
Vox Dei
Indeed we all have our dreams, but in most cases they remain just that, i.e dreams, unless we decide to work hard for it and be patient enough to realize them. In our country I'm afraid, patience is not present and we settle too often for second best, this includes our politicians.
ReplyDeleteRamkalawan settled for second best when he gave up the fight and is comfortable playing the role as LOP and reaping the fruits of its benefits. Mancham gave up the same fight and found a comfortable place in the sun playing the great embassador and man of the world. Even Chris Gill crossed the floor claiming he did so in fear and enjoyed the advantages of being an SPPF man in his business life.
Now everybody is going for gold again and want to get it within one miserable year, but lack the backbone to even participate in the race. The could be united opposition is a cripple and has no chance whatsoever in the coming race. That is my simple message to you all and you can do whatever you like with it.
As to all of your messages of getting rid of the SPPF/PL as you put it all I can say is that by wishing that you are showing the same sign of democracy as the PL practices, i.e none. A democracy consists of several choices, preferably more than two. In my opinion a so called democracy with 2 options is not a good one as the choice will always be between two evils or two saints. What I see coming if the SNP should win is the same situation as we have now, i.e a discrimination of all the PL supporters and ex-PL people because the SNP are no different let alone better.
Chris Gill on the other hand has the sole intention of removing the PL due to hatred of the party, the same party he once joined. I support Chris in many ways and agree that he has done a lot of good, but a leader who is so full of hate of such a big part of the population can never be a good leader. Sorry Chris, but your mission is motivated by vengeance. What would you do with all the PL people if you should get power?
Volcere? Another case which I'm not even going to bother commenting as we all know how useless he'd be as leader. He can't even run a B-rated newspaper for crying out loud.
But back to Ramkalawan: A trusted source of mine has told me that Ramkalawan has said that IF he should find a leader that can match himself and his being, then he will consider stepping down. Now what does that say about Ramkalawan's ego and view of the people around him? Would you vote for a prezident who cannot trust anyone around him?
As to my age I will again confirm that I am in my mid thirties. I have never said I am in my mid 60s nor said anything about my age apart from making a comments saying 'when you reach my age you realize...'. My entire point was to put you all in my 'sak gouni' and show you how easy it is to fool people in politics. And you were all fooled. Learn from it and memorize the following quote:
'Believe what you can feel, half of what you see and nothing of what you hear(or read for that matter)'
With that I can say I'd look forward to the new political picture I've heard about, but until I hear or read about the new party and feel the handshake of its leader I will believe nothing of it.
In the meantime I wish STAR, its bloggers and all Seychellois, home and away despite political belief and/or standpoint, a happy and prosperous 2010. May you all within the coming year make your standpoint to vote whoever you believe is best for Seychelles.
Patrick X
Happy new year for all bloggers who sincerely would like a dramatic change in our little island where all seychellois would be respected for what they are.
ReplyDeleteMay god bless us so that in the years to come all of us would be abled to use our really name becuase we will be a free nation,
Thanks again to Mr Gill for coming with this initiative which have provided all seychellois who wish to be free from the grip of the devil SPPF/LP a forum to voice out their opposing opinions.
I also wish that this year those who are desperately trying to lend the SPPF regime to tighten their evil pschological shackles would realise that seychelles is their motherland and every seychelles deserve the opportunity to prosper and be free.
Remember what our great teacher the lord Jesus Christ has thought Us
I quote DO ONTO OTHER WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE OTHERS DO ONTO YOU.
Thank all bloggers especially those who are united in body and soul to try and educate our fellow seychellois that we have the power to exorcise the evil JJ spirit from our land and live in peace and harmony.
From a seychellois
Did that same Jesus Christ also tell his followers to burn others at he stake? In what way would you excorcise the JJ spiritists?
ReplyDeletePatrick X
Reply To Patrick X
ReplyDeleteI have done a homework for you this is what a meant by exorcise.
To free seychelles from evil: to use prayers and religious rituals with the intention of ridding seychelles of the supposed presence or influence of evil spirits.
You are well informed ask the founder of JJ spirit what they meant by JJ spirit.
From my stand point i know of only two spirits that is good spirit or evil spirit. From my personal experiences JJ spirit couldnot be a good spirit since its founders are atheist. Eventhought they have tried to hypocrically aligned themselves to the churches for votes all their actions are anti-christ.
I do know that a lots of churches goers are praying for the evil spirit to be exorcise.
I am very sorry to tell you that i do not condone violence and in all my comments on this blog i have never use any violent terms. So this i would rather leave for you as you are good at insulting other bloggers and a master of distortion and deception.
Next time use a dictionary if you want to know the meaning of a word.
From a seychellois
I'm fully awar of what exorcism means Seychellois, but was wondering what your version was as religious people often tend to make their own convenient interpretations of such words.
ReplyDeleteI can however tell you that it will take a bit more than prayers to make change in Seychelles. I would also like to state my utter disgust to fanatics like yourself who can only see the wrong causeddue to atheism. But since we're in the subject of insulting others, what are you going to do about the religious spirits of our muslim, hindu, bhuddist and other believers that make up our population? Will you excorcise them too?
As to anti-christian actions, I would recommend you to go do some more homework and refer to the history of the Catholic Church and their doings in the past.
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteThank you for labelling me as a fanatic. What a compliment?
Yes i am a fanatic for freedoom of expression and longing to live in a society where my fellow human beings are not oppressed for their political conviction, where my bother are not denied their opportunity to study abroad because their parents are not SPPF supporters. Where we are not allowed to make our government to give us an account of how they have managed our limited god given resources that our parents have worked for it.
My dream is for my kids to be able to breathe and to know what freedom is really is not the pseudofreedom of the SPPF regime.
My dream is to see a seychelles where intellectual ability and the intelligence of the seychellois is valued but not suppressed to give rise to mediocrity, lack of creativity,inability to discern and to develop in seychellois the psychological construct called learned helplessness.
Me i stand for the empowerment of the seychellois people so that they will not have to choose from your so called two devils but they will be able to explicitly defined what sort of leadership qualities their leader ought to have.
So when they are allowed to develop to their full potential they will be able to know that where the current is stronger. This is where the pitfall is.
As for the spirit of all the other religions are concerned i am afraid this is well documented in various literatures but the JJ spirit i am afraid is no where to be seen in the history literature. So it is right for me to respect the religion of others. If JJ spirit is a religion or a cult i am afraid that i have not been able to broaden my horizon on this new religion simply because there are no literatures on the JJ spirit religion.
To conclude whether you like it or not my dream is to make sure that the seychellois people has chance to experience the really democracy.
Firstly by educating my fellow seychellois to understand that real democracy will never take its roots as long as SPPF/LP is running the show.
You and I know they will be always an impediment to real democracy as they had burried it by the coup detat on 5th june 1977. They have no intention to revive it. Once a dictator always be a dictator.
Sorry much as been promised for more democratisation but we are almost at the same crossroad as at midnight June 5th 1977. So the struggle must and will go on.
Give me a break there is only pseudodemocracy in the seychelles.
Thank you so much for our esteem exchanges of comments.
From a seychellois
I have no problems with your dreams Seychellois, it is shared by 80+ thousand of your Seychellois countrymen and women, myself included. What I do not agree with is your exorcism and view that because our leading politicians are atheists, their system is evil.
ReplyDeleteI don not say that their system is right or is always the best for Seychelles, but callling it evil is a what I call religious fanatism, especially when you start dragging God into the debate. Religion is religion, politics is politics and when our country consists of people with many different beliefs I see your fanatical views rather discriminating of those who do not believe in your God. I bloody well hope that if one day you enter politics for real you have the sense to at least keep religion out of it.
Don't get me wrong, I respect all religions, but strongly believe that they should be kept out of politics, especially in a country like ours with so much religious diversity. I dare not think the consequences if a person like yourself should ever become prezident and what your views would be to for instance a Muslim politician let alone a Hindu because sooner or later one from a non-Christian religion will enter politics. And it will happen more sooner than later.
So again a fighter for democracy has shown non democratic views. Animal farm all over again. The day you can show respect and understanding for those who do not share your religious view, that day you'll deserve the democracy you scream for.
Patrick X
I reply to Vox-
ReplyDeleteIn your last post you mentioned that I hinted to forming my own party.
The discussion for a new party has been ongoing for some time.
The need for it is borne out of only the existing parties failing the people, here I refer to the Opposition camp. Hence, I have said before and will again, inspite of the shortcomings of all the good fellows of the Opposition, we must give them every opportunity to dialogue and lead with the objective being unity for change in Seychelles.
I have started that process, but I cannot act alone. All parties need to engage.
Opposition is like a chain- it is only as strong as its weakest link. This is so because the SPPF P.P. are in fact brutal, are in fact fear-mongers, as Patrick X demonstrates over and over to us, and finally, they are BANKRUPT of ideas.
Now, I am not the only person that has thought of forming a party. Mr. Boulle is on the road as well.
In discussions with him, I agreed to prepare a Manifesto. I have. He has it.
My final point is this Vox: A Party Should not belong to any one man.
It belongs to the electorate inspite of whatever great sacrifices an individual may make to a party.
This was the failings of DP, that believed the Party formed by Mancham, belonged to him.
Rene SPUP and SPPF is the same thing and they still hang up Rene's photos in a white safari suit,to make the whole party look silly to their detriment.
We must go beyond this petty perception of parties. They are not private assets, nor I would say are salaries of MNA's in Opposition,today that have the excessive 38% increase, hence the effect of fatten the Opposition and making them complacent.
But I will write about that later.
I agree with you Vox on your assertions.
Unfortunately for P.P. the next party to be formed will be a party that will unite all opposition that have stayed divided until now over petty issues. It will not be a party of division in rank and file.
To stop the pillaging, we must stop the divisions. Those that advocate a policy of continued division, will advocate tacit pillaging on their parts.
For that Patrick, I am sorry, if that does not meet your expectations. I am most certain that Patrick would enjoy shaking the hands of a hundred new party leaders.
Have a good weekend.
Christopher Gill
Hi Mr Gill
ReplyDeleteHappy new year to you!
Whatever your future undertakings in the politics of seychelles please count on me for your support?
You may not know me personally but on the very few occassions that i had met you we had always exchanged some few words. Infact i had in the past bought nouveau seychelles weekly specifically to read your column. So keep on writing to make the psychologically blind seychellois to get their mind eyes back so that they can see again.
Thank for your relentless effort together with all the others to try and forge a lasting unity between the oppositions which i think is long over due.
Ego in the past and self glory have been the main obstacle to that process as you have rightly stated.I hope all the leaders in the opposition will not repeat the same mistake.
Mrs Clinton said in the autobiography of her husband that the road to insanity is repeating the sam mistake over and over again with the expectation of getting a different outcome.
This time i am afraid that this will be the litmus test for all oppositions leader to hear the wake up call that every seychellois want to hear in the seychelles. That is a strong harmonious and unitified opposition in deeds and actions to reclaim our beloved country the seychelles and bring our dignity as a nation back.
Those who have retired but countinue in inject their venom into the political arena i am afraid that the will go down in history like all the other failed dictators of the world
I am very optimistic that it will happen and if SPPF/PP decides to call a snap election, the opposition will be ready to step in the ring.
Keep on striking the hammer because politically the iron is very hot in the seychelles and fail ideas are starting to crumble like the great wall of berlin.
From a seychellois
Failed ideas may crumble like the Berlin Wall, but as long as the opposition(s) sit by and watch as they wait for popularity to land at their feet the PL will keep on building new walls. The NYS crumbled as did many other white elephant projects, but did they lose popularity? We lived over a decade with Forex shortages and NAPA, but the PL still won elections. It seems that the more those ideas crumble, the more popular the PL becomes.
ReplyDeleteI know why and have been trying to tell you all, but all you see is me being a PL supporter. It's like you can't see the forest for all the trees.
Christopher writes that the PL are brutal fear mongers and he is so right in saying so. Problem is that you all see anyone who disagrees with you as a PL supporter and freeze him/her out instead of listening and maybe getting new impulses. Patrick X(that's me) is a perfect example of someone who is trying to give you impulses, but all your paranoia tells you is that he must be a die-hard PL because he points the finger at you.
For every day that goes by you(the opposition) lose support and popularity. I was recently told that a relative of mine, a die-hard SNP the last 15 odd years, was now starting to have doubts about Ramkalawan and his strategy(or lack of it) and is actually seeing some good in the doings of James Michel. The person is in the late 50s and hence not a naive youth. I think more and more Seychellois are sharing the same view.
Have you ever asked yourselves why? Maybe it's as simple as the following quote:
'When you're alone at sea, even a pirate's skiff may seem like the best option and a chance for survival'
Patrick X
Reply To Patrick X
ReplyDeleteWhen you are alone at sea, you say even a pirate skiff will look enticing.
Well Patrick- as per the letter written by President Michel to IMF, we are already dead, so a Pirate Skiff will not help anymore.
So you may as well let the world know you are not a door mat and stand up and be counted as human being as God intended you to be.
Your pirate skiff is about to make life really miserable for you. That, you will not be able to blame the Opposition, except to squeek a little word saying,"is Ramkalawan meeting with IMF".
I have faith that one day, you will be writing articles for upload on STAR Patrick. You just have to have a little courage, enough to abandon the pirate skiff theory.
Christopher Gill
Chris, what I'd do or what you'd do is one thing, but what the majority of Seychellois have done in the past 2 elections pretty much shows that they decided to join the pirates seeing them as better option than floating adrift and risking starvation or ending up dead. You of all people should know what is it like to join the skiff as you did so yourself in 1998, did you not?
ReplyDeleteLife has been miserable for many people and it will get worse, but they still seem to refuse to change sides. Now why is that? Maybe my pirate skiff theory holds water after all?
But I must say though that I am a rather poor example as my life won't be made miserable by the PL(you can call them Pirate League if you want) as I don't even reside in Seychelles or have done so for a long time, but many I know will be affected and will have to tighten their belts a few notches more. Some I'd saywill benefit from it, others I pity greatly and help when I can.
But speaking of joining the skiff. What has Ramkalawan done, has he not also joined the skiff by keeping quiet and doing whatever he's asked to do? Joining the IMF for talks is a perfect example of joining the skiff by being mute. Being against June 5th celebrations, but going for a picnic the same day is another perfect example. The best however was your stunt by going onboard when you were made to walk the plank by Mancham back then. Oh yes, Mancham also joined the skiff after he got back his land and wealth.
So where does that put all of you in the eyes of the Seychellois voters? I'm not against you Chris, but I am telling you where you stand and what you will be accused of in due course. For every accusation you meet, you'll need a counter-atatck plus a backup to blow back in their faces.
As to writing on STAR, I'd love to and the day I do I will do so with my full name. I garuantee you that if you can garuantee me that my article will be printed regardless of who I criticise and praise.
Patrick X
I reply to Patrick X last post- "The Skiff"-
ReplyDeletePatrick- in a totalitarian communist society, many people do what their conscience tells them not to do to survive.
This is called the will to live.
In the Opposition we all understand that. Hence why everyone has been more then reseptive towards me.
Only SPPF and P.P. have a problem with me crossing the floor.
Too bad for you, I suppose.
When someone jumps a skiff,
you do not blame the individual for his will to survive, you blame the system, that has sapped the individual of his full potential, hence a lessor country and lessor society results from it.
Today, we are a failed country, because too many remained silent for too long under oppression.
Ramkalawan- quiet, perhaps he is guilty of battle fatigue, or he has gotten too comfortable. The system has these built in regulators to make someone of not strong mind and spirit to become comfortable. A nice salary, VIP, car, body guards, a little land, it all can get to someone, if not checked.
But he Ramkalawan can shift gears and I encourage him to for a better Seychelles. It is not just "Yes we can", today, it is "We Must Do It".
Mancham- Only wanted what was rightfully his and his family. He has gotten some of his land back, but not all. P.P. SPPF still keep him on a string and deny him what is his.
This is a disgrace to humanity since Mancham is now 70 years old.
Rene Michel have so much hate in them, that they let this man suffer in vain for what belongs to his family. His children suffer fot it and his brothers children suffer for it.
Crossing the Floor - Patrick, kept me alive.
If not, based on my free speech, I would be dead by now.
The Speaker of National Assembly Francis Macgregor advised me of this in National Assembly.
Crossing the Floor did not make me an SPPF business man. It made SPPF have no choice but to leave me alone physically.
It did not prevent them from squeezing me to death practically in business.
At the time, Rene sent armed men wiith guns to my house, before the speech I gave on EDA which was to encourage MAFIA to our shores and grant immunity to criminals.
State House thugs kept coming to my house with guns. The incidents are all well documented in letters to Rene as President of Seychelles, which were not denied, but accepted in silence.
Michel when he first became President, and after I started writing used the same tactics to send men,known killers, to my house in Praslin. But this time I did not stop writing, because I know this time, if I do not write, Seychelles will be worse off for it.
These incidents under Michel administration are documented and not denied by him.
All the Business Commmunity- Patrick, is entitle to remain in the background, because if they do not, they will be destroyed. But when it counts, they do pull through.
Seychellois citizens are the same.
Politicians must carry the challenge for change forward, and they must do it bravely in unity.
When that happens, no one crosses the floor! Maybe then you can jump skiff!
Christopher Gill
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeletePersonally the bloggers are right not to take you seriously.
First and foremost your comments are so inconstitent and incongruent to that of other bloggers.
This makes me believe that you have the same genetic make up as the iraqi information minister during the last iraq war called the desert storm. Where he was misforming the iraqis population with regard to the progress of the iraqis soldiers on the battlefield.
And the rest of the story you know quite well i suppossed.
Even if you alleged that you are living abroad but it seems to me that you have had some very sound instruction in the communism doctrine a la SPPF. You should be a prime candidate for a medal for misinformation and distortion.
Anyway like you once said in one of your comment that seychellois people reason like African. I am sorry to tell you that you are not any different.
I was very surprised that from the letter that your pirate in his skiff had written your only comment was wether Mr Ramkalawan would be attending the next IMF meeting. With your vast knowledge in politic you should know by now that a leader of opposition is relevant in a modern and civilized democracy where there is the rule of law.
As as far as president James Michel's letter is concerned there are nothing new in there and the only thing that he has confirmed that his home grown economic reformed program is really an IMF program that was brewed in the USA.
Let me affirmed to you that our sufferring has started since the 5th june 1977 and all these years the seychellois people has been rationalising their sufferring thinking and hoping that it would go away. Like a battered wife thinking that the violent nature of her husband would just go away without him acknowledging his negative behaviours and willing to go for counselling/therapeutic sessions.
I am afraid that one day the seychellois will reach their breaking point and they will refuse to be rescued by the pirate in his skiff full of salty water. Because they will know that one thing that a seaman must not do when he is in trouble at sea is not to drink salty water because it causes confusion and later leads to hallucination.
Next the person will jump into the sea thinking that there is an island in sight and this i am afraid will lead to his demise.
So keeping on telling us that there is dust in our eye when you have not removed what is in yours.
I hope that you are not living in Cuba, Russia , Zimbabwe and not in seychelles for that matter.
From a seychellois
This article is good. I thank the writer for the effort put forth to clear the air of lies and misrepresentations by P.P.
ReplyDeleteI have been following comments on blog and I think Patrick X is no over seas. He works at State House.
Why? Because-
1. baggers Ramkalawan to attend District meetings, when you would have to live in Seychelles to follow those.
2. Same issue above, District meetings official line was about the empy chair in each district for Ramkalawan and other opposition
3. Baggers Ramkalawan for meeting with IMF when in fact, this is the P.P. line again and not public sentiment/.
4. We all know that public knows P.P. under IMF grip because country has been bankrupted by SPPF.
5. Attacks Gill always, even pushed him to write about Budget. I read that article, and Patrick X said nothing about it likely because Gill intellectually overpowered SPPF in on that article.
6. Patrick X said nothing about Chamber of Commerce input which is substantive.
7. X does not find excuses for Rene and does for Michel, which is State House line.
8. X has no solutions that are coherent, only attacks opposition lef tright center.
9. X seeks no common ground in Opposition to improve things
10 X advocates fear politics and does not attack SPPF for that.
That for me, is pure SPPF
Fear Factor
Fear Factor, I'll give you resons 'why not':
ReplyDelete1) The district meetings were announced on Nation's online edition the day after they were held, hence anyone is able to read the ongoings, naturally from teh Nation's point of view. There is also something called 'internet' and several media that cover the ongoings in Seychelles where Indian Ocean Newsletter is one of them. You'd be amazed how useful a Google alert can be. Oh yes, you'd also be amazed how many spread local news via e-mail and blogs just like this one.
2) The district meetings were pure propaganda on the behalf of the PL in order to show that they wanted to listen to the people. By attending thos Ramkalawan could have challenged the prezident on several points and maybe made some people see his side of the story. Instead he couldn't be bothered to do so. I believe every politician who is against the PL should have attended every single one of those meetings, not just those in their own district.
3) By not attending the meeting Ramkalawan showed once again that he is not interested in serving the public, only himself. You'd be surprized how many members of the public he disappointed by not meeting the IMF on such thin grounds. You do remember his excuse right? He didn't say he didn't want to, only that the invitation was not according to his golden standard. Again he failed the people.
4) Yes indeed the PL are under the IMF's grip and åpersonally I hope they stay there for a while to come till things get straitened oud. No secrets there. The PL on the other hand are trying to give the people the impression that they are running solo. And people believe it.
cont...
cont..
ReplyDelete5) I do not always attack Gill as I praise him fwhen he deserves it. Trouble with Gill is that he has a history that can and will be used against him and he has to be prepared to defend himself. I am giving Gill the best advise by asking him to be serious and to show the PL and avery other party respect. Not necessarily because they deserve it, but because he needs to show sincerity and show that he is capable of being at the top. The way Chris writes sometimes I wouldn't even employ him in a shop to sell ice-cream.
6) Excuse me, but you must have a special definition of the word 'substantive'. Is it not substantive enough that I clearly state my opinion saying that the tax reform is a necessity that is 2 decades late? I also clearly said what I meant about the tax redution on personal vehicles and what it will lead to reagarding harm to the environment and damage to our roads. I'm sorry if you disagree with my views, but if 'substantive' would have been agreeing 100% with you, all I have to say is 'tough luck'.
7) Rene's time is gone and as I've stated earlier I totally agree that he did nothing but fail Seychelles and its people as a whole. Get over it or try suicide if it's too hard to swallow. Done is done however wrong it is. James Michel is now prezident despite the fact that Rene is still pulling strings, ref the Sunset Road diversion case etc. Point is, raving on about Rene is like playing a scratched record. If half of Seychelles choose to do so, then so be it. I'm done with it.
8) I attack the opposition as I cannot see them to be any more credible than the ruling PL. To my opinion they are just as useless and lack anything that even resembles democracy and fairness. Again I justify my saying about PL being the evil we know which I would vote for if there was an election today. For all I know, my vote is being used in a cunning way by the PL. As I've said before, I do not reside in Seychelles and don't even have an ID card.
9) Since I've been bloggin here I've given advise upon advise upon advise to all regarding how to improve things. Now if you're too thick to see ti or too proud to acknowledge you own failures then I'm glad that you are not sitting in State House right now.
10) What fear politics hwta I've advocated? I've just toild you(opposition) what I see you're doing worng and hoping that you take it into account and improve it instead of seeing it as pure critism. I don't need to trick any opposition party and help them to fail even more. You're doing a better job at that the PL could wish for.
I may sound like pure SPPF to you, but you lot sound like pure Paranoids to be. Maybe you can call that new party SPP(Seychelles Paranoid Politicians).
And to 'Seychellois', people do take me seriously, Gill and yourself included. Else you would not bother spending time replying my posts.
Patrick X
Patrick X, I am tired of you castigating Ramkalawan every time you post. Just give it a break.
ReplyDeleteThe man did not bankrupt Seychelles. Albert Rene, James Michel and their forty thieves did.
Ramkalawan did not have a coup d'etat and put Seychelles where it is today, but those 2 power hungry murderers did.
Ramkalawan has not invited Arabs, South Africans, Mauritians, Russians, French, Indians, Irish and Chinese to Seychelles to take our land, our jobs and our dignity. Rene and Michel did.
So let us serious Seychellois and Seychelloise who by the way LIVE IN SEYCHELLES and not overseas fight to take our country back from these killers and murderers who continue to hide behind an army and their guns.
And by the way, when you learn the difference between "advise" and "advice", come back to this blog and join the real Seychellois men and women who are working day and night to give YOU, your children if you have any, your family in Seychelles if you have any, a chance to taste freedom and an opportunity for a better life.
So wherever you are you coward, think of what the likes of Ramkalawan, Annette and Bernard Georges, Mancienne, Volcere, Mancham, Gill, Gerard Hoareau and others have done for our country. Think of Simon Desnousse and Hassan Ali being tortured and brutally murdered at the hands of Albert and Michel's thugs; think of their families who have suffered. But think more about those martyrs who have died so that a coward like you can taste freedom. And then when it has sunk into your small brain, come back here to tell us that the SPPF-Lepep party is the better evil! Yes, they are EVIL alright, but Michel and Rene are 2 cowards who send murderers into the night to kill for them so that they can stay in power and enjoy the wealth they have both stolen from our country and our children and grandchildren. Is this who you want your children to look up to? Is this the party you really want to vote for?
I am proud that we have Seychellois men and women still willing to fight for a better Seychelles and for democracy. We do not want JJ Evil Spirit, let alone his handouts as we are the workers who keep this country afloat. We do not want one rupee land as the Arabs are enjoying from an idiot President who continues to give away the little land our forefathers left us. We do not want to live by guns and bullets. We do not want Irish people running our Police Department while our own people with experience are getting sacked. And we certainly do not want or need French people to come to Seychelles to run PUC while the average Seychellois bills go up so that we can pay their fat salaries and perks.
Enough is enough and the last thing we need is another sucker called Patrick X licking the SPPF's ass and praising them while kicking others who have moved us closer to a true democracy.
For this reason Patrick X, I will give my support and my vote to anyone who can lead us out of this evil empire of Rene and Michel. I truly hope they both burn in hell for all the pain and misery they have caused to the people of our country. History has proven over and over again that evil empires and their leaders always crumble, and that GOOD prevails every time.
So Patrick X, you can remain a coward and join the evil empire and keep them in power or you can become a hero by helping Ramkalawan, Volcere, Mancham, Gill, Boulle or whoever else sticks their necks out for you so that when you return to Seychelles one day, you can smell the air of freedom. Until then, I urge you to write about the real evil in Seychelles. That is, the SPPF camouflaged as Lepep.
I thought democracy was abut having the right to say one's say and speak one's mind and be respected for it. I can see your definition of democracy is the same expectp that it only applies if one agrees with you.
ReplyDeletePatrick X
I reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteThe last two blogs, unnamed, ask you to jion forces of change for a better Seychelles.
You see how open the Opposition can be Patrick X?
It is also so democratic, it can forgive you, inspite of your self.
The Branding argument is funny coming from you, as you have been the main blogger that departed from the debate of ideas to the debate of character assasination of Gill, Ramkalawan, Mancham, Volcere, and others. If Gill did not keep his cool, the blog could have lost its value.
But Gill kept his cool and the blog has evolved to become valuable to Seychelles, even you.
Gill and the Star team has done more work for advancement of democracy in the form of Free Speech through this blog, then Rene and Michel have in 32 years.
Ironically, this blog cost Gill and Star Team- not a cent.It is free to them and free to you as a visitor and blogger.
Seychelles is on the move Patrick X- it is not moving backwards, it will move forward, until P.P. is packed up and it will pack up.......and go. SAD but true for Michel Rene and pack!
You will note that Michel could not even hold up to a 2 yr. IMF plan, he had to beg for a 3 yr. plan.
Christopher Gill
I reply to Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteYes Democracy is about having your say and speaking your opinion.
This is the entry level Democracy, which P.P. has denied Seychellois until today.
Democracy is also about defending your position in public debate. When your ideas fail, you do not keep your position. You allow the better idea to rule the day and adjust yourself accordingly.
Furthermore, in a democracy, wherein ideas are debated Patrick, and you have to deal with people, you must distinguish between a Public Figure and a Private Figure in the debate.
You ought to respect the privacy of the Private Figure, and call for the position of Public figures, in order that you may gauge their ideas, opinions, capacity,etc.... This affects their ability to get elected.
You mentioned that in a way when you say Ramkalawan should have attended the District consultative committee meetings.
I do not agree with you. Reason being, these meetings were packed with Michel JJ spirit loyalists and the whole process was rigged with the grace of District office bathroom sweepers, that are paid to yell scream on call.
If Ramkalawan was present and others from the Opposition, it would have resulted in a circus.
However, if Michel was honest about Democracy and efforts to move in that direction, he would have negotiated a path for debate with the Opposition. But we are not in an election year.
The Michel Administration is obligated to present its plan to the people and defend it.
So far, it has been an IMF Plan and Michel has not defended it well. His stratezi 2017 has been shelved and is now Trazegi-2017
Opposition has taken a stance, albeit passive. They need to step it up(opinion). We need peaceful protests over cuts and measures that make us suffer. We need protest over missing $2.4 Billion (no compromise as this is people's money).
It is Michel Adminsitration duty to step down to these protest and allow them or be damned to status of TYRANNT!
Christopher Gill
Dear Patrick X /Mr Gill
ReplyDeleteI am referring specifically to the issue of whether Mr Ramkalawan should have attended those public consultative meetings and engaged the IMF.
On the issue of the public meetings, i am of the opinion that yes Mr Ramkalawan/SNP MNAs should have attended but not on SPPF/PL terms. Instead of sitting on the table with JJ, they should have sat amongst the people they represent and asked questions to JJ and team. This would have had the following effect: to show that the Opposition is with the people and put questions which would have probably embarassed JJ/team. I still remember in my teens attending consultative meetinf in "Lapay Galere" at Mt Fleuri in 1990 (or around that time) and watching JFrancois Ferrari (with not more than 6 people) take on the SPPFs. We were still in one party state, but you could feel the admiration some hardcore SPPF had for JFrancois. It is no surprise that JFrancois is now the elected member of Mt Fleuri. In this Mt Fleuri meeting JFrancois was shouted at, but he stood his ground.
The situation in those meetings is not any different from the Nat Assembly, which is rigged and chaired by an SPPF/PL member.
By not participating, in the meetings, the Oppositon left the SPPF/PL with an open ground. It is to be noted that Bernard Georges would have attended the meeting if he was in the country. I believe that Georges participation in those meetings (if he stands again in the election) may be in his advantage as it has shown that he is interested. Those meetings were almost all about "problem semen, lalimyer, drenaz ect...", people are concerened with those type of issues more than anything else.
On the issue of meeting with the IMF, Ramkalawan/SNP should again have met with them (if i am not mistaken he has met with the IMF since then) but afterwards he should called a conference de presse. In the abscence of SBC, he should have reported the content of the meeting in REGAR. Subsequent meeting by Ramakalawan with the IMF team showns he was wrong the first time not to meet with them.
I wish to add something else, i believe that we should take criticism of our political leaders constructively. Critics have been made on the dictatorial nature of Ramkalawan, as yet i have yet to see any explanation, instead i have seen only attacks and name calling on fellow bloggers. Can somebody sincerely explain to me the issues surrounding the resignation of Mrs Soundy as Treasurer of the SNP, or other resignations that has hit the SNP over last year. Isn't that signs that somewhere something is wrong? Democracy is about making the leaders accountable, as a people we are allowing our politicians get away (literally with murder) with a lot of things which are not democratic at all.
Vox Dei
Reply to Vox
ReplyDeleteResignations Occur in both communist party and as well in a democratic party, at least this you would agreed with me.
To that matter resignations do not make a party less communist or less democratic.Remember poor Archange Michel may his soul rest in peace was expelled from the SPPF assembly and from the party because he did not agree with the SPPF leaderships on the issue of abortion which conflicted his religious views. So resignations happen everywhere in the world.
So for that matter if you truly want to know the reasons for some resignations in the SNP party which i think is a natural phenomenon. What you should do is to arm yourself deplomatical tact and approach these people so that you can access these informations from the right sources and not through the grape vine. So getting other people to get the information for you is not an intelligent way to get informations since it is you who want to know.
I respect your opinion but i would not agree with you when you said that Mr Ramkalawan has a dictatorial nature.
What i would have agreed is probably he has a dictatorial management style?
So to broaden your horizon, you have to be aware that the management style of an individual is influenced by your working environment and philosophy of his instituition.
But one thing that has been most puzzling for me, is that for the last thirty years the management of the SPPF leaderships have not changed at all. Even by managing a passive flock of sheep like the seychellois people their style of leadership could be compared to the world worse dictators in the world given that we are very small.
For Patrick X put it as it fits best for you. I am personally not taking you seriously but simply refuting your distorted one sided comments with the sole intention of character assassinated Mr Gill and Mr Ramkalawan by trying to play the devil's advocate. If blatantly insulting your friends means giving advice, i am afraid you have to think very hard a it because it bares very close resemblance with past Albert Rene Speeches he gave during his so called liberation day on every 5th june when he was the president for life.
From a seychelles
Vox Dei:
ReplyDeleteYou have read my mind and spoken fro me. That's all I have to say. I just hope that now bloggers here understand my view and opinion. Enough said.
To Seychellois:
I appreciate you realizing that Ramkalawan has a dictatorial management style, but if you analyze the ongoings withing the party you'll see the same style there too. I believe the man has(had) the best of intentions, but cannot handle the heat or handle losing. I would be most reluctant to work near such a bad tempered leader during times of pressure. THe man needs to sort of his personal issues within himself before continuing as leader. And I sincerely believe that he must resign as leader, but assist the new leader in his/her job. Remember, it's not the leader who doea all the work, but the entire team.
Patrick X
I reply to a Seychellois. No sweat i am well informed, my reference was for a debate around the reasons given behind those resignations. I have read the letter of Mrs Soundy (letter which was leaked to the SPPF/PL by a still Exco Member of the SNP, i agree resignations occur in evry political party but when the Treasurer accuses party leaders of stealing party funds, back biting other leaders, and acting in dictatorial manner, i consider it as pretty serious.
ReplyDeleteDo not misunderstand me, i am not attacking Mr Ramkalawan personally but his management style does not seem to fit what is generally understood to be democratic. As a consequence of such style he is alienating a lot of supporters.
Frankly whilst i frown on that, it does not seem that stealing public money is an issue with the population (otherwise the SPPF/PL would be out of power), but managment style of the leaders of the SNP is not bearing fruit, in fact the contrary is happening. Like it or not, as it stands today the only alternative to the SPPF/PL is the SNP and its Leader, but i feel that Ramkalawan does not have what it takes to topple the SPPF/PL. After so many consecutive electoral defeat as a people we must be looking at other alternatives, and leaders should realise when their time is up!
Vox Dei
I agree with you 100% on your last chapter Vox Dei. As I mentioned in a thread further up, a very liable source of mine says that Ramkalawan has said thatt if he finds a leader worthy of him, then he'll consider stepping down. Now if that is not dictatorial then it's definetely bad management.
ReplyDeleteAnyone who has run a business or participated in a project knows the necessity of having a backup for the leader who can step in at any given time.
So if Ramkalawan can only see himself as leader, what kind of system will his party be able to have when running Seychelles? I believe he'll be even more paranoid than France Albert Rene himself. We all remember Rene's elections: Yes or NO. Ramkalawan practices the same type: Like me I'm staying, despise of me I'm still staying.
Now is that kind of leadership a worthy alternative to the PL? I think not and neither do a majority of our voters.
Patrick X
Reply to Vox
ReplyDeleteGenerally i totally accept your reasoning in your last comment and i totally share your views regarding to Mr Ramkalawan defeat in the last three elections.
Yes personally i am convjnced that with a new leader for the forthcoming election the opposition would definitely stand better chance of doing better, not because Mr Ramkalawan is a bad choice but politically it is the right think to do after three consecutive defeats.
And i believe that the opposition have so much other candidates that given the opportunity can surprise the SPPF hierarchy.
But i am convinced that sooner rather than later when the time is right the opposition will strategically to the right thing for the love of seychelles because a leadership change in the seychelles is within the reach of the opposition if they can strike the right cord and field the best candidate.
Having said that i am afraid there are some who are trying as hard as they can to get the opposition to regurgitate their election strategies before the election date has been communicated official with the sole intention of getting the SPPF to counter the opposition strategies.
So i know that the brain within the opposition leaderships know what i am taking about. In a war you do not let your bitter enemy knows what you have in your armory. This is pure logic.
Oppositions having gone through three elections know the type of vicious, ruthless and power hungry rival that they are up against.
So this time they can only get it right and there is no better opportunity that 2011.
From a seychellois
It's what you have in the amoury that determines the outcome of the battle, it's the people's will to use those weapons and the strategy of good leadership.
ReplyDeleteAs far as I can see, as of today, the armoury is empty, there is nobody willing to fight and the leader has no strategy for the coming battle.
But as advised to Chris Gill earlier(I'm not counting on Ramkalawan to lift as much as a finger), a fight must be put up to show sincerity and preparations must be made for the 2016 elections. Let's hope Ramkalawan will step down after the coming defeat so a new leader may take his place and SNP may have a chance to survive.
Rumour however says that SNP will be terminated(dissolved) in early 2010. Now that rumour comes from a die-hard PL who cannot see any other colour than red so for all I know it's just propaganda to demoralize SNP supporters. I wish however that Ramkalawan would step forward and decline or confirm the rumour.
So far the only thing I see in that armoury is tennis balls instead of canon balls. And not a canon in sight.
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteThank you letting your true colours out again.
All seychellois know that the SPPF will come back and swallow their excrement. Like they did with the once upon a time monster IMF and now they are happily in bed with IMF like first time lovers.
We all Know Patrick X the great teacher is always right so we can rename you as our great local Nastrodamus who lives abroad in spirit but physically reside in the seychelles probably in the state house as one blogger rightly speculate.
The election is not yet announce you already know the outcome. I bet you have consulted your magic mirror.
I hope that the dead will be reborn again and start voting on election day and go back to their tombs at midnight when the results will be announce like in the great democracy of Robert Mugabe.
Good luck in your great prediction our great guru. I hope that one day you will not push Mr Ramkalawan aside and say to him that you have been the stauncher supporter of SNP than him.
The usual seychellois syndrome being the SPPF at election day and opposition after election when all their broken promises are staring at them right in their faces.
Me as the moto goes! i would rather die than serving the better devil,their Arabs, russian,south African and their mauritian friends and the Savy royal family.
So keep on looking in your crystal ball.
from a seychellois
My crystal ball, as you put it, says that PL is secured a victory in the coming election. Indeed the IMF is seen as a monster by many and not so long ago a die-hard SNP said that we didn't need the IMF to help pull us out of the quick-sand France Albert Rene and his clique put the country in. On cannot blame James Michel entirely as he was merely a puppet under Rene.
ReplyDeleteOne can say a lot about the SPPF/PL regarding making a right mess of things, but they have an incredible ability to adapt and survive. Accepting help from the IMF is a good example of this ability to adapt and survive, a bit like joining that Pirate Skiff I was talking about. The same one Chris Gill joined when his butt was on fire.
The PL adapt and play on all possible strings or the most convenient strings which holds them alive. The opposition on the other hand have been playing on the same string since the multi-party system was re-introduced. They're still crying about about the coup d'etat and Rene's rule. Their main objective is to remove and erase the PL from the face of the earth and turn the clock back 33 years. It's not doable.
What the opposition should have done when the crunch happened last year was to be 1 step aside James Michel in all matters be it meetings with the IMF, CBS and every single delegation that visited Seychelles in connection with our finance in addition to our pirate problem. By stepping aside and keeping away Ramkalawan gave James Michel the armlength he needed and wanted to do whatever he pleases. You were offered the chance to cooperate and have dialogue, but the LOP was too arrogant to accept those invitations as they did not match his standards.
One doe not need a crystal ball to see what's coming in 2011. Common sense and intuition is enough.
As to me, my soul is in Seychelles and always has been, but my presence is unfortunately not and cannot be for a while yet as I have more important commitments here for a while yet. In the meantime I will be a 'pinez morpen da zot fes', and that applies to anyone who is not doing a job to help Seychelles, be they SNP, DP, PL or whoever else turns up trying to make a quick buck from the country.
Before I go I'd like you all to answer the question raised in the following blog:
http://www.seychellestoday.blogspot.com/
By the way, the name of the blog would be a great name for a newspaper.
Patrick X
Patrick X- In one of your previous comments you stated that you are very good at creating order out of chaos and that you are very good at it, you have also shown the reverse to be true.
ReplyDeleteI still stand by my observation about you.
You are a wolf in sheep skins.
Now you will be a 'pinez' in the rear end?. You should be on another forum.
You have become very transparent. The more you write the more transparent you become.
I cannot believe you can sincerely think that your comments are helping the cause. Most of the time you tried to point blogers into a direction of your chosing. Are you trying to influence blogers opinion patrick?
Will you ever, disect the PL like you are trying to disect the oposition who by the way is not running seychelles to the ground.If they were, all credit to you, however, they are not- the one at the control is the PL.
J.
J,
ReplyDeleteAny fool can make chaos out of order, but it takes quite a bit more to make order out of chaos. A city can take years and even centuries to build, but a 3 minute earthquake is all it takes to destroy it. An atomic bomb can even do the same job faster.
Now since you're dieing to hear me criticize France Albert Rene I can turn it around to please your taste buds: It took years for Seychelles to become free from UK, but only hours to become trapped in a dictatorship that lasted over a decade. Sound better?
I am happy that you are seeing through me via my writings. It shows that you are intelligent and read my other writings in 'another forum' as you put it. I've been giving many hints so it's about time someone reacted. :-)
I am indeed a wolf in sheep skin at times, but are you sure that is a wolf underneath the sheep skin or would you simply find a sheep in wolfskin underneat that sheep skin? Me I wonder what kind of skin you'll find under Ramkalawan's sheepskin cover? Bear skin maybe?
But J, I've dissected the PL so many times now and know exactly what's undernaeth the surface. The PL is corrupt and rotten to the bone, that's no news and we all agree that they have during the SPUP/SPPF and partly PL rule run the country into a deep stinking ditch. No arguments there and I have no problems whatsoever agreeing that Rene and his clique were nothing but a bunch of thieving vultures that were only interested in their own benefits. We agree on that, i.e common knowledge.
When Michel won the last election, several critics said that he should be given a chance, myself included. Now, almost 5 years on I see that Michel has really made an effort to straighten things up after his predecessor who left us in a right mess, this despite his involvement in the coup and his puppet role as Minister of Finance. For making that effort I give Michel credit, not because I agree with everythign he does, but because he has tried and made an effort which is more than I can say about Ramkalawan.
Now think about this little thought experiment: Let us say Michel was to eliminate all corruption in Seychelles within 2010 and imprison every corrupt official in the country. Which percentage of all civil servants would be left to do their jobs? Now do you think Ramkalawan would act differently if given the choice of cleaning up the same mess?
We know it's the PL who is running th country and has caused the mess. That is beyond the point. My point is that SNP as it is today is no better, has no better democracy and doesn't have the experience nor the knowledge to run things better let alone the people. They don't even have a bloody secon in command for crying out loud. I'm saying they're bad, I'm saying they're just as bad.
Patrick X
Oh yes, to your question about wether or not I'm trying to infleunce bloggers' opinion:
ReplyDeleteBlogging is about creating debate and finding several moments of truth, something I can't see many of you being able to. We all want others to agree with us, that's human nature J, but no I am not trying to influence other bloggers' opinion, I am merely trying to create debate, but I can see that most of you can't handle a debate. Just like in 'the other forum'. ;-)
Patrick X
This train has gathered momentum, you will need a lot more to derail it patrick. I can see you are doing everything you can. The other forum was not necesary, but then again we now know what you are capable of. Is it part of your grand plan? You are one piece of work!
ReplyDeleteJ.
Momentum eh? If there is a train that needs derailing it's the big red one running on subsidized diesel.
ReplyDeleteThe green train has lost steam my friend and has come to a halt, i.e no momentum as that requires speed and mass. It will need substantial amounts of coal shoveling to start up again. It lost steam because it's engineer has been abandoned by his crew hence nobody to shovel coal except for the engineer himself who unfortunately is too lazy to even make the effort.
So it's up to you guys to derail that train. You can always try blowing up a bridge it passes, but please make sure to stand far aside when you do. You know, someone promised to send Ramkalawan a green shovel, but so far he hasn't kept his promise. Maybe that's what he's waiting for so he can start shoveling coal. Who knows?
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteI would like to share one of the concept of management with you which is applied equally in politic which is called (group think).
Group think is layman term simply means that in a cabinet of ministers once a decision is approved .Every memeber of the cabinet has accepted the decision taken whether he likes it or not. If he/she strongly disagree, he/she has to resign as simple as that.
Before he was elected president Michel had served in the cabinet of minister of Mr France Albert Rene. He had never submitted his resignation as a minister. Therefore he was part and parcel of the right mess that you talked about. Refer to your last comment.
Now you have the gut to tell us that he was a puppet minister.
What is he now as a president?
Now it makes more sense why you true believe in the better devil because according to you. He was not responsible for the mess that we are in today because he was not the president therefore he is the better devil.
Cont'd
So my friend think again because do not need to be a rocket scientist to be able to use your grey matter.
ReplyDeleteCorrect me if i am wrong you said that he his now cleaning the right mess. How can a mess be right?
Personally i stand to be corrected since i reside in the seychelles so far i have not seen any improvement that Mr Michel has made for me personally or my family.
Probably for your family i suppossed?
I would like to quote some of the comments that he made after he was elected.
1.The seychelles economy is sound and strong.
What happened in 2009?
Why are we serve our master the IMF?
2. I would put more dollars in the pocket of the seychellois people? Are the seychellois better off today as far as their pocket are concerned?
3. In two years i would doubled the GDP of the seychelles?
What is our GDP today?
What was it before he was elected?
4. The chance of oil discovery is very eminent.
Are we not still waiting for the first barrel of oil coming from the seychelles territory?
If all these things had happened sure he would have my stamp of approval. And i would give him a big yes for the job well done.
For the time being he has done very little apart from his celebrity stunts which involve million of television appearances, travelling in the gulf states almost every other months, recieving undeserve medals right, left and centre of intangible achievements and for pleasing his foriegn friends with our god given natural resources and all the other things that we are seeing happening right now in the seychelles as i write.
What an achievement from the better devil?
I may be wrong but i believe we are observing is a grand SPPF/PLP conspiracy which the SPPF disciples are trying to sell to the seychellois public. Especially those who are eating the crumbs like all the majority of us.
The conspiracy goes like that
He is a good guide and is he really trying his very best but you know the world's economy crunch is holding him back.
Is that not what you are selling to us Mr Patrick X in the name of helping the seychellois people given that your spirit is abroad and your coporal body is in the seychelles.
This conspiracy is very good for the SPPF hierarchy because it serves them right and this include James Michel too.
Your assertion that if all corrupt public servants are brought to justic. There would not be qualify public servants to do the job is a very lame excuses which fits very well with your good devil theory. So there is no point in having a court of justic and to that matter a constitution.
What is the percentage of public servants who have access to government fund?
Please stop insulting our intelligence and to that matter it is your legitimate right and our constitutional right to support James Michel.
Do not try to fool us with your good devil theory because for seychelloises who are not psychologically blind like the many unpatriotic opportunists who think only of themselves and the riches of the earth and pretend that they are serving the people of seychelles. This propaganda would not work.
Whether you like it or not the SPPF/LPL apparatus will crumble like the so great empires of the ancient world.
As an opposition surporter i would agree that Mr Ramkalawan has maintained his principle not to participate with James Michel for any consultations. Please do not give the impression that Mr Ramkalawan had never attended a consultative meeting with James Michel. All sechellois who resides in the seychelles know what happened soon after the engagement.
Please stop slandering people in the opposition. Do your work as a propagandist for SPPF/PLP as per your job description.
From a seychellois
I reply to Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteYour comments on Rene ruining the economy and Michel trying to celan it up are wrong.
I explain.
When Rene retired, Seychelles had $440Million in external debt accumilated from 1977-2004.
Between 2004-2006, Michel borrowed more then Rene did in his entire dictatorship.
Michel implemented no reforms until Seychelles was officially BANKRUPT in Ocotber 31, 2008.
The IMF plan was not an option for Michel. He had no option but that Plan. Failing that, the cars would stop runniing, the country would move to failed State Status.
Many SPPF say and they are right, Michel is worse then Rene.
You cannot compare the two to be different in results, both equate to FAILURE.
You seem to be bent on Ramkalawan. I know he is no Angel, but firstly, he is not respnsible for this madness. Does he have solution? Let's give him a little time to see what he comes up with.
SNP have released my Speech in Creole, which you asserted, I could not deliver, and did. 3,000 copies I understand are floating to seychellois homes, and they do care about their well being. That is why they will listen to the speech. They will vote according to there interests and that is not P.P., Patrick, I can assure you of that.
I can talk to SPUP SPPF people. They understand me, I understand them.
Do not confuse the fact that I choose not to interact with the leadership of corrupted people in P.P.
You can dress up Michel as much as you want. Pluck a montblanc in his shirt pocket, it will not give him the power to write legibly.
That is why Patrick, sometimes I write for the ice cream parlor crowd.
I am trying to get Michel to understand what I am saying, so I drop the level of writing, since he would not understand me if I sounded like Boulle, which I can when so duly required, to so sound.
Give Michel millions of dollars, he will not know what is the best way to spend the money unless someone tells him.
I can go on, but the point is, when leadership faulters, it must be removed. No if ands, and buts, or butts about it Patrick, removal, is the remedy. Replacement, we will find.
The replacement must also be a cure and an aggravation of the illness. But do keep on open mind as change requires it.
As per your blog, one is enough for me for now. Address your questions here, and they will be replied here.
We want 20,000 visitors by the end of the month and 35,000 before Michel gives the State of Nation Address.
As Nation prints 3,500 papers a day and 1500-2500 come back from the Districts, I believe STAR is doing a very good job at spreading information in Seychelles and abroad.
P.P. is losing it Patrick, better start sending the rumors out on a coalition government. Start telling people something is in the works to head off defeat.
Christopher Gill
To Seychellois:
ReplyDeleteLet's start with a little lesson in English slang: The word 'right' in the expression 'a right xxxx' does not mean 'correct', but 'real', i.e 'a right mess' means 'a real mess', 'a bloody mess' etc. Had you lived in UK you would have known that. In other words it's simply a term like 'en beze bef', 'en pake poum' etc. So the mess I was refering to was not 'right', but very 'real' and not least evident.
Of course Michel was a part of the parcel as you put it and is/was responsible in that sense. No objections there and I have been a harsh critic of the SPPF system and their lack of democracy not to mention lack of competence. Again, no disagreements there as they're still incompetent in many areas, but the way I see it they are still the better option as your camp has nothing to offer, at least nothing better.
You say that so far you havn't seen any improvement for YOU and YOUR FAMILY, but I'm sorry to say that Seychelles is not about you and your family, but about the Seychellois in general as a people. The fact that you and your family cannot afford to run your air-con, light your entire property after sunset or have 3 cars is not what this is about. It's about our reserves increasing so that we as a nation are self sustainable, have enough fuel to power our generators and not least have enough to secure imports so our shops have adequate supply of goods so you and your family don't have to fish eveyr day in order to have dinner on your table. My family is facing the same challenges as yours, the same as every other family, but from what I hear from a source that has just returned from Seychelles, things are ok enough for people. The shops have things although relatively expensive and Victoria is full of shoppers, forex is available and there still are no beggars in our streets apart from those outside every roadside store asking for beer money.
In reply to Michel's post victory comments you have to realize that the words are those of a politician, nothing more, nothing less. We all know that the economy was far from sound and solid as Michel took over a heavily endebted country from his predecessor who I personally blame for the mess we're in as he was leader and sole decision maker all those years, and a very bad one too. Again, no dispute there. Michel knew very well what state the country was in economically, but to admit failure would have been political suicide and making bad investments he did no different than the Chris Gill's Republican friends on Wall Street or the Icelandic govt who now refuse to fix the mess they created for others.
As to his promise to double our GDP I believe however that it was scheduled to be done within 2017 as a part of 'Stategy 2017', not in 2 years as you claim. According to Chris Gill Strategy 2017 was officially dumped by Michel, but according to Nation as late as April 2009 the plan was still a reality. I commented that to Gill in another thread, but he has declined to reply.Wether or not the strategy is achievable is up for discussion and personally I think it's impossible.
cont.....
cont....
ReplyDeleteSeychelles as a coming oil nation is on the other hand possible and judging from the great help been getting from the Americans in the fight against piracy I'd say chances are big that we do have oil and will pump sooner or later, but you have to remember something: We are located in an area surrounded by Arabs who also happen to have an interest in us not speeding up too much in selling our oil. Can you imagine why? Personally I hope we never sell one single drop of oil as it will lead to our country becoming even more corrupted than it already is. And if you think that striking oil is going to give you and your family a better life, think again. Trust me when I tell you that just because a country produces and sells oil doesn't mean that the inhabitants all strike gold. Remember that.
Seychellois, for the umpteenth time, I am not saying that the PL is better than the SNP in any way, I am merely saying that the PL is the better evil(not devil) as it is the one we know. The other evil has already shown its incompetence in cases like democracy, strategy, honesty and not least transparency. I am not slandering the people supporting the opposition, ref SNP or DP, I am slandering the leaders of these parties(or rather the lack of leadership within).
But tell me Seychellois, which consultative meetings did Ramkalawan attend? The one in his own district? Can you actually confirm that he did attend that one single meeting? Which other non PL MNAs attended their respective meetings, not sat aside with the PL, but as part of the public? Now do your resaearch well before replying, because this can very well boomerang back in your face giving me another reason to justify why I see the PL being the better evil at this moment.
As to my alledged job as a propagandist I have to disappoint you as I am here excercising my freedom of speech and defending my opinion the way I personally see things. Frankly I think you'll find that a majority of the Seychellois agree with me. Not that they support PL, but see them as what they are: the better evil.
I can however tell you one thing: If my job was as propaganda manager for the PL, we wouldn't even be having this debate and there wouldn't be a single non PL seat in assembly. That I can promise you.
Patrick X
Now to Chris:
ReplyDeleteIf your figures are correct regarding what Rene borrowed and lef the country endebted with then we can say that they are pretty much both guilty. I am not defending Michel on his part in teh process, but I am defending him for making an effort and showing the will to clean up, a will rene did not posess as he not only endebted the country, but also clearly stole from it.
If may SPPFs/PLs say that Michel is worse than Rene it is merely because their standard of living has declined during Michel's rule, not because Michel is useless or worse than Rene, but because Michel has after all introduced more order in the chaos, ref made an attempt to clean up in the corruption. I'm sure you yourself preferred Rene as you personally benefitted economically from his system when you walked over the floor.
Ramkalawan is not as you say responsible for the madness, but he certainly has not done much to even prevent it or reduce the damage, especially after we were declared bankrupt as you put it. Since the last election Ramkalawan has been a puppet for the PL and danced to whichever tune they've played on their magic flute. He reminds me of a castrated circus bear who's had his claws and teeth pulled out and is now just a mere harmless figure who looks dangerous from a distance.
You say that Michel cannot write legibly? Who the hell are you to talk about writing legibly when you at times can't even write any different than a 9th grade pupil high on testosterone? You won't get anyone to understand you as long as you don't treat them with respect that they deserve. You cannot gain respect let alone get anyone to listen to you as long as you refuse to refer to them as the PL and not PP for instance. I can get away with that, with insulting a politician or public figure as I'm a nobody who calls himself Patrick X. You are a public figure, a front figure and an example. Sorry to say this, but sometimes you seem as ignorant as Robert Mugabe when he responds to critism. You may impress the corwd at the ice-cream qeue, but that's all you're impressing. If you want success you have to impress those at the top becuase they are the ones you'll need backing up from in the long run.
But Chris, I totally with you that leadership MUST be replaced when it fails to achieve results. I have no disagreements there whatsoever, but I do disagree with changing a bad leader for another or a bad system for an equally bad one. That is the whole point in my blogs here, not that the PL are good, but that they are a better evil than the SNP.
I disagree with you when you say that the PL is losing it though. As long as they are the only option to the SNP who have already lost it, the voters next year will either refrain from voting(included some PL voters) or vote PL as the better evil. Those lost votes will not count anyway and there is a PL majority in the population, hence they win either way. Sorry to say it and sad that it is the case, but that unfortunately is the truth. THe PL could have terminated the SNP any time if they wanted to, but they need Ramkalawan there for political reasons and need him the way he is now: A castrated circus bear on a chain eating out of Michel's hand.
cont...
As to a coalition govt I can't see that coming, but it would be interesting as I did propose it on another blog prior to the last election as I didn't then feel that Seychelels was ready for a sudden changeover to SNP in lead. Back then I believed in Ramkalawan and he had my full support, by I still did not feel that Seychelels was ready for it and I'm sorry to say that I was right. Ramkalawan and many SNPs being against help from IMF I dare not think what the situation today would have been because the bankrupcy would have taken place regardless of who sat on the controls.
ReplyDeleteBut again, a coalition can take place in 2016 at the earliest. Put up a fight next year and show your intentions and then start working for your strategy 2016: Going for gold! I say you bacause I've lost all hope for the other OPs
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteFor your informations Mr Ramkalawan had in the past attended consultative meeting at state house on the invitation of Mr Michel.If i can stand to be corrected.
This was what i was referring to.
From a seychellois
Reply to Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteStrategy 2017
was shelved by Michel in an SBC interview, I told you that and it is dishonest, to say that I did not.
It is overzealous on your part to intellectually ignore what I said, and then to paint my confirmation of the shelving of the plan in apparent silence on my part in rebutal. Inference being, I am hiding something.
This shows you are politically "bent", and motivated by your brief to "asre lick", as you best put it in describing yourself and what you do best.
Today Patrick X, under what plan is our economy being managed, Strategy 2017- that promised 10% GDP per annum to double our GDP in ten years, or are we under an IMF Administration Plan to keep us from sinking in the next 3 years?
The answer is IMF PLAN 2012!
While you are priveleged to hide under a ghost name, please do remain intellectually honest. For if you fail that, even your ghost name will have no credibility and our visitors to Star will drop.
Coalition Government
This is an idea worth exploring. I do not shut the door on the idea. I have met with a group of leaders in the Opposition and I have agreed with them that they must explore all possibilities for the betterment of Seychelles.
I am most certain they will be charting a map and present it to P.P. at some point.
I personally will not form part of this group.
But I will listen to what they have to say and consider it seriously, because they are not just some big mouth ghost writer that goes from one intellectual spectrum to another.
If you are doing that out of fear of being killed murdered maimed, then I pardon you. Being that you are in UK, and not at harms way, thus is not pardonable.
However, that does not mean we must go soft on Michel or Rene. In my mind for a coalition to work, the failing mechanisms must go, or else we will end up like Zimbabwe.
I am also most sorry for touching your beloved "lessor of evils" leader Michel in my comment about his fancy pens in pockets.
However, we all know Jean Paul Adam has to walk Michel through every step and write everything for him.
Mr. Adam is tasked with making order out of chaos and giving some semblance of normalcy and direction to the Presidency.
It is one thing to be normal- it is another thing to fake being normal or act the script of normalcy.
I am afraid your "lessor of evils" leader is just an actor, who plays for the camera, and press hogs the media, controls the flow of ideas on our society,while offering the public very little in fact.
Till today, Michel has never told us that we are a BANKRUPT Nation.
For that, we all fail.
Christopher Gill
Reply to Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteStrategy 2017
was shelved by Michel in an SBC interview, I told you that and it is dishonest, to say that I did not.
It is overzealous on your part to intellectually ignore what I said, and then to paint my confirmation of the shelving of the plan in apparent silence on my part in rebutal. Inference being, I am hiding something.
This shows you are politically "bent", and motivated by your brief to "asre lick", as you best put it in describing yourself and what you do best.
Today Patrick X, under what plan is our economy being managed, Strategy 2017- that promised 10% GDP per annum to double our GDP in ten years, or are we under an IMF Administration Plan to keep us from sinking in the next 3 years?
The answer is IMF PLAN 2012!
While you are priveleged to hide under a ghost name, please do remain intellectually honest. For if you fail that, even your ghost name will have no credibility and our visitors to Star will drop.
Coalition Government
This is an idea worth exploring. I do not shut the door on the idea. I have met with a group of leaders in the Opposition and I have agreed with them that they must explore all possibilities for the betterment of Seychelles.
I am most certain they will be charting a map and present it to P.P. at some point.
I personally will not form part of this group.
But I will listen to what they have to say and consider it seriously, because they are not just some big mouth ghost writer that goes from one intellectual spectrum to another.
If you are doing that out of fear of being killed murdered maimed, then I pardon you. Being that you are in UK, and not at harms way, thus is not pardonable.
However, that does not mean we must go soft on Michel or Rene. In my mind for a coalition to work, the failing mechanisms must go, or else we will end up like Zimbabwe.
I am also most sorry for touching your beloved "lessor of evils" leader Michel in my comment about his fancy pens in pockets.
However, we all know Jean Paul Adam has to walk Michel through every step and write everything for him.
Mr. Adam is tasked with making order out of chaos and giving some semblance of normalcy and direction to the Presidency.
It is one thing to be normal- it is another thing to fake being normal or act the script of normalcy.
I am afraid your "lessor of evils" leader is just an actor, who plays for the camera, and press hogs the media, controls the flow of ideas on our society,while offering the public very little in fact.
Till today, Michel has never told us that we are a BANKRUPT Nation.
For that, we all fail.
Christopher Gill
In a previous recent tread patrick X was in his 30s. I cannot understand this line from him earlier on though.
ReplyDelete"Calling Chris young man might sound patronising, but that was not my intention. When you reach my age, anyone seems young. No harm meant, but I will refrain from repeating it".
Patrick, chris is righ, you do stray from one spectrum to the other at times, this makes me think more and more that I have been right about you all along. Is your style of interaction on this blog by design or by default? I guess one can only speculate, i would however, go with design.You are one piece of work patrick. I will admit however, that I like reading your post; not for it's intension or its undeniable support for PL at present, but for the extent you will go to try and create confusion/doubt among the bloggers.
J.
I do not see why we need a Govt of National Unity? And why would the Opposition come up with such a plan is really beyond my comprehension! Our political system (and behaviour of voters) are such that political party winning the election is guaranteed to get a confortable majority in National Assembly and whoever wins the Presidential election is guaranteed of wining the Nat Assembly elections. I do not see this pattern changing now or in the foreseable future. Seychelles politics have been marked over the last 70 odd years with a 40/45 % v/s 55/60% split between the Govt and Opposition. Generally this has been the pattern and will probably continue to be so in the near future.
ReplyDeleteFor the Opposition to present a plan of coalition govt is a sign of weakness. In any case SNP has always scoffed at the idea when proposed by Mancham, and for them ever to present this as an option will be interpreted as a sign of weakness and desperation by the SPPF/PL. The SPPF/PL can barely give the importance due to Leader of Opposition/Opposition in the Nat Assembly, what makes us think that they would be willing to share the Govt?
Frankly, i believe that this proposition is just a diversion, a diversion which would suit laze leaders of the Opposition, who would rather go through a back door rather than work hard and win an election.
Vox Dei
To J:
ReplyDeleteMon frer, of course I tricked you pretending that I was much older. I put all of you in my 'sak gouni', now get over it and get on with life. I won, you lost, so what?
Chris:
I must say I agree with Vox Dei when he says that the OP wants to unite as it may seem an easy way to victory, the same as they wanted to give Seychellois abroad the right to vote because they think that every Seychellois living outside Seychelles is not in favour of PL. Think again.
The fact that Jean Paul Adam is as you say 'writing every speech' for Michel is only right and it's his damn job to do so. Maybe if you guys also accepted help and advise from others you also would be writing better speeches and articles. Next time you decide to publish one of your texts, mail it to me first and I'll help you re-phrase it in a way that it'll tickle everyone taste buds, even PL buds.
One thing is for sure: You(Opposition) will never be in power unless you put it a lot of true hard work starting at the grass-roots. That I can garuantee you.
Sorry if I missed some of your questions, but I'm in a hurry today.
Patrick X
Looks like Gill has beat Patrick X to a dust.
ReplyDeleteCongratulations Gill. Handled like a professional.
Change your name X, ask Jean Paul Adam for a new name.
Koste Kapot
THE THIN LINE BETWEEN COALITION AND COLLISION
ReplyDeleteThere is a lot of speculation and some say will to form a coalition government in Seychelles. There is talk about a United Opposition forming an alliance with the sole purpose of removing the PL from power in 2011. Some also speculate in a new party being formed as well as the termination of the SNP as we know it today. Regardless of the differences between speculation, will and reality I believe that we will soon face an interesting political development in the months to come and up to the 2011 prezidential election.
The opposition has had a hard time winning elections since the re-introduction of the multi-party system and reaching their goal of taking power over from the SPPF/PL although gettting as much as 46% of the votes in the last election. Why is that so and why has there not been a coalition government? Well, the main reason is that Seychelles has basically never had more than two parties big enough to be able to form an alliance that has enough majority to overthrow the party with most votes. In recent elections our voters have had the choice between two parties, namely SPPF(PL) and SNP as the third alternative DP refrained from participating. As we know the last election gave the SPPF/PL majority leaving the opposition as powerless bystanders.
So what's the remedy to 'kick the PL ou' as many put it? Kicking the PL out is in theory simple, but requires a bit of devotion and determination from all other parties who want to give James Michel and his party the boot. First of all, the voters must be given multiple options, not merely a dual option. A dual option often gives the choice of two evils, especially in teh case of Seychelles where the voters are fairly split. You are either pro SPPF/PL or con and if you are con then whoever the other option is will get your vote despite the option being just as bad, i.e a lot of Seychellois vote in pure despite of the happenings of June 5th 1977. Back in '76 people were either for Mancham or for Rene, today they are either for Rene or against Rene as he is still seen to be the one in charge and the PL exploits that to its extent.
What will a worthy multiple choice do in an election? First of all, people will no longer have the choice of the evil that they know and the evil they do not know and instead have an additional choice which canfirst of all be a magnet to votes that are in doubt in addition to a sign of hope and change. A new alternative to PL and SNP can represent a positive change in Seychelles especially for those who feel they have been struggling the last 15 or so years. A third altenative will naturally have the potential to steal votes from both PL and SNP, hence reducing the PL's majority from let's say 54% to maybe 48% or lower which is an achievement enough to topple the PL dominance in Seychelles politics. All a third party needs in order to remove the PL is to gain slightly more than 4% of the votes, this based on the last election's figures. 4%, that's all! Then what?
cont...
cont...
ReplyDeleteIf the PL are reduced to 49% popularity that means that the other participating parties have a majority of votes and can form a coalition and finally 'kick the PL out' according to plan. A coalition will leave the PL as minority and a new coalition government can be formed. However, having majority is one thing, but having majority as part of a coalition can easily lead to collision. The mutual objectives of non PL-ism may well be to get rid of the PL, but running a country, even one as small as Seychelles, can prove to be harder than expected, let alone forming such a government.
It would be natural for the biggest part of the coalition to get the prezidentila post, but conflicts in interest, conflicts of opinion and not least the strong Seychellois character regarding the ongoings of the past can easily lead to fighting behind the wheel and a certain route to collision. I would therefore strongly recommend that before an eventual United Opposition gets together to 'kick out PL', other mutual goals and most important of all disagreements are settled, agreed upon and a crystal clear set of rules of cooperation are written before any attempt is made to form a coalition.
Another thing that is important to bear in mind is the fact that a coalition government in Seychelles does not necessarily have to consist of for instance SNP+DP. It can just as well consist of PL+SNP or PL+DP. By having an open mind, we should realize that even politicians sometimes have to make the choice between two evils, just like the voters.
Patrick X - How's that for dust?
I reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeletePatrick- please, relax, enough with the long winded comments.
Its ok, if you feel better though.
In reply to your very last post:
A coalition government is not possible under the Constitution of Seychelles.
We will need an amendment, and we are expecting Jean Paul Adam the man who gave Patrick "Pillay" the X to draft something soon. That is in the P.P. rumor mill.
Christopher Gill
Ok, I wasn't aware of that it was against the constitution as of today. And if so then I guess it never will be as long as the PL is in power. Why would the PL want to change that as it could lead to their defeat?
ReplyDeleteBut as you can see, even if it was possible/permitted, it is also opened for a coalition between whoever offers most and whoever is willing to offer most to get it.
So then I guess that only a new party consisting of DP, SNP, your new party, Boulle's Party and any other party together as once huge multiparty will be able to topple the PL from power in 2011. Again I still believe it's too late for it, at least for 2011 and even if you did pull it through I think it would be more of a collision than a coalition. I just hope I'm wrong.
Patrick X - Ni Kile, ni Pile
Mr Gill, i beg to differ in as much as i do not believe that a Govt of National Unity is against the Consitution. Whoever wins the Presidential election appoints his ministers. In which case he is free to appoint whoever he chooses including people from the Opposition, effectively making a Govt of Nat Unity. I think it is extremely unlikely that the President will find himself in a minority in the Nat Assembly, though thoretically we can have this situation.
ReplyDeleteThe last time Mancham proposed this, the SPPF and the SNPs scoffed and made fun at the idea. I have never heard this proposition come for the SPPF/PL, but Mr Gill says above that he has discussed that proposition with the Opposition Leaders (i am supposing the SNP and DPs), and frankly i really cannot see why this and why now, when the SPPF/PL has an extremely comfortable hold of power (and looks likely that they will win the next elections).
Another matter which i believe would be determinining factor in any post electoral agreement is TRUST. We must not forget that the Judiciary has given a strict interpretation of the Constitution in the last Elizabeth/DP v Speaker Nat Assembly/SNP case. The SNP argued that there was no written agreement, and in any case even there had been an agreement it would not have been binding, since the power to appoint/remove Proportional member of the Nat Assembly rests in the Party Leader. That approach was followed by the Judiciary, even if on appeal it was decided that a certificate should have been issued. In which case maybe the "outgoing" would have remained until he had exhausted all legal remedies.
So how does one go about that?After what happened between SNP/DP over the Nat Assembly seat, it unlikely that politicians would trust each other especially where agreements cannot be enforced? Which leads me to believe that if ever the need for a Govt of Nat Unity would ever arise, as the Constitution is actually it would be only a matter of blind faith in whoever legally holds power.
As to a unified opposition, after the way Ramkalawan/SNP behaved towards the DPs, only them (the SNPs) can create the environment conducive towards a unified opposition. There is a likelihood that Mr Gill's is just being used and taken for a ride, and will be discarded by his new found friends once he is no longer useful. History has a habit of repeating itself especially with our politicians.
Vox Dei
I forgot to add that whilst Albert Rene is still around, a coalition govt between the SPPF/PL and Opposition will never happen! He was unwilling to share (in 1976/1977) even when he was a minority what makes us believe he will do so now.
ReplyDeleteHowever it is not inconceivable that the SPPF/PL may be behind the whole thing, in as much as they have tossed a bone at the Opposition to play with (when they should have been concentrating on ways and means to create unity and winning the next election) whilst they quietly consildate their base. SPPF/PL has almost all the time wrong footed the Opposition when it came to announcing the date of election, i will not be surprised that this may the case this time too. :(
Vox Die
sorry, i meant to say it is conceivable that SPPF/PL is behind the "coalition" story!
ReplyDeleteVox
As an SNP surpporter i was gutted with the way they treated the DP after the election.
ReplyDeleteI stand to be corrected that uniting the opposition may be quite a difficult task because one of the commodity that you cannot afford to lose is trust. And once you loose it. It is extremely difficult to get it back.
Having said that it does not seem to get down with me the idea of having a coalition government with SPPF. Unless the oppositions have decided to let the SPPF enjoy all their illgotten riches. If this happened i am afraid this would be even worse than the coup d'etat.
Talks like that i am afraid will prove once again that the opposition is very weak and that they are not ready to take the mantle. As the SPPF has always proclaimed.
I hope that building a coalition with SPPF is merely a speculation.
For the time being i rest my case on the issues. Because it is becoming very scary.
From a seychellois
Seychellois:
ReplyDeleteCongratulations, you're getting what I define as an 'open mind'. Nothing more to say than quote myself:
'By having an open mind, we should realize that even politicians sometimes have to make the choice between two evils, just like the voters'
Patrick X
Someone offer Patrick X a fishing trip.
ReplyDeleteHe is getting pitful.
It just goes to show how low people can think. Those that take this low thinking mentality are P.P. supporters.
But for his credit, he has challenged Ramkalawan and SNP to get off the toilet seat if they are just going to sit there.
Aside from that, Patrick X is a paid political mercenary who is tasked with confusing the opposition follows.
Lera Rosse
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteJust to let you know that on the issue of coalition with the SPPF.
I am still treating it as a mere speculation. That was the reason i did not further comment on it.
Since i am in touch with my elected SNP MNA. I would make it my duty to bring that point to him.
But as far as i am concerned political leaders may make their propposition but the final decision rest in the hands of an electorate.
I am not buying this story any way because i will never vote for any opposition which forms a coalition with SPPF/PLP. That is the bottom line as far as i my concerned because do not forget even if i am an individual in any election the percentage is calculated on the number of turn out of the electorate.
So i am not worried about this issue because i donot vote with my emotions but with my brain.
From a seychellois
I concur with "Seychellois"!
ReplyDeleteI would add that the SPUP SPPF P.P. are nothing but a crimnial organization, and anyone in my mind that opts for a coalition with a criminal organization does so at his/her own risk.
However, that does not prevent P.P. today from cleaning up its act.
How?
Read below:
1. Prosecute the top 15 individuals that stole the most money.
2. Retire the old leaders that have blood on their hands, even their own family.
Then you can qualify for coalition discussions, perhaps.
Back to you "Seychellois"!
Christopher Gill
Reply to Mr Gill
ReplyDeleteWell! We are basically on the same wavelenght. Letting these criminals to go without retribution. Would be like setting Al capone free of all his evil deeds.
Yes! any coalition which involves the top brass of the SPPF/PLP apparatus would be a carbon copy of the government of national unity in Mugabe's kingdom. If that was going to happen the seychellois would not progress at all as a nation.
For that matter even a coalition which involves Danny Faure would be a total disaster because he leadership style involves intimidation and lack of respect for his adversary. Typical of Albert Rene's leadership style.
I truly believe that there are some up coming LPP leaders who could be trusted but they all in the back stage and probably a coalition within this group would be more feasible.
Personally my wish is to see SPPF/LP defeated in a free and fair contested election.
So it will be important to see how they will digest this evenuality when it happens.
Remember their slogan seychelles is for SPPF.
I am extremely optimistic that this evenuality is in 2011.
From a seychellois
Lera Rosse:
ReplyDeleteWhy am I so pitiful for speaking my mind and why is it so low to think the probability of SNP allying with the PL so that one of their own can get a ministerial post? After all, Chris Gill joined the PL hoping for the same some 10 years ago(he does however claim that it was to save his own life). I can however tell you one thing: If I was paid my usual rates for blooging my opinions here I wouldn'n need to work elsewhere, alas I'm doing this in my free time and of my own free will.
Seychellois:
You say you will never vote for any opposition which forms a coalition with PL. I'm sorry to say this, but the opposition has already formed a coalition with PL by
- Not aiming to win an election(and saying that they are glad they didn't win)
- Not participating in important meetings(IMF)
- Not participating in the district consultative meetings, hence allowing Michel to gain many votes
- Simply complying with all the crap PL comes up with by not lifting a finger to oppose it
- Attending cozy cocktail parties(much more important than meetings concerning national interest)
The list goes on Seychellois so like it or not, by voting SNP you are already supporting the PL as Ramkalawan has no interest whatsoever to win the prezidential election, none whatsoever. He is there solely to milk the system and get his salary till he retires.
I'm glad you can see that there are PL people who truly intend to do good and that they are not all crooks like many at the top now who have been there since the Rene era and are corrupted by his poisonous rule. I believe that Michel does mean well, but he has too much of that old blood on him to become 'Mr Sheen*. I do however believe that maybe when Jean Paul Adam takes over(trust me, he will), the PL will have a totally different image. As to Danny Faure ever becoming prezident I just pray that it never happens as he has neither the charm or intellect to perform such a job. A circus monkey would achieve better results.
Chris Gill:
Yes, a clean-up is needed, but we do not have the means to perform such a project. Hell man, our judiciary doesn't even have the capacity to deal with the normal criminal cases and you want the 'Top 15' dealt with? I believe we also practice 'innocent until proven guilty' so until hard evidence can be shown the 'Top 15' are innocent. Not that I believe that they are, but from an evidence point of view they are. You being a lawyer should know that. Besides, who is going to look for that evidence and how long will it take? Sorry to say, but right now we have more important issues to deal with. Besides, Rene has one foot in the grave and with him several will go down as their protector will no longer be able to protect.
Anyhow, I am also 100% for a majority voted prezident/government as I am a supporter of 'winner takes all' and have seen a lot of crap in coalition governments. I do however sincerely see the advantage of minumum 3-4 parties participating in any election. I have however read the Seychelles Constitution, but cannot see where it says that a coalition of parties cannot lead to a prezident being elected. I am no expert in legal matters so I would appreciate if someone who is could point out which part of it states so.
Patrick X
This is Lera Rosse-----
ReplyDeletePatrick X is a human worm. He says PlP does not have time to prosecute the Top 15 thieves and that our judiciary is not capable of handling them. patrick says gov. has more important things to do .
human worm that defend the government but he or shee cannott defend what he says using hs name.
I call that a Human Worm.
Lera Rosse
Lera Rosse:
ReplyDeleteSuch a case would exhaust our judiciary unless one performs a 'chinese style' prosecution, the type Rene was rather fond of remember. Now would you sink as low as that?
Think also about who would lead such a case and how hard it would be to find Seychellois that are nbot partial to work with it. We could always hire in more expats, but then again what would the opposition say then?
As you can see it's not as simple as you think.
Patrick X
patrick xx----------
ReplyDeleteu find excuse for judicial process against "top 15 " who stole money.
but many of my friends from school are reading this blog.
1 friend told me to tell u that u said u r nt expert on law or judiciary. so hw cn u comment in defence pf this people that destroyed seychelles?
this is not acceptable to youth of seychelles.
anather friend says the judicial system cn prosecute us for a little cannabis, but u and rene michel get away with stealing $2.4 trillion from seychelles.
u r still a worm patrick xx.
mr. gill,thank u vry much. we r watching wht u do happy new yr,sir.
Mr. Lera Rosse 2patrickxx
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteOn the issue of prosecuting the SPPF officials for their corruption. I have found it absurd and ludicrous that you have taken such a stance.
As the last blogger has rightly stated if the seychelles justic system is good for petty thieves and the so called Escobars who are little drug traffickers.
Why is that same judicial system not good for the SPPF elitists. After they set the judicial system and your better evil Mr James Alix Michel told us that our judicial system is very good and impartial.
So your argument do not make sense because your better evil said so when he appointed the new chief justic.
Remember when Mr Mancham proposed a truth and reconciliation commitee similar to that in South Africa. They SPPF leaderships refused to accept and since then they have gone to commit another big crime that is to bankrupt our country and reduce the seychois people to beggars and IMF slaves.
If our justic system can prosecute foriegn nationals for crimes that they have committed outside seychelles for illicit money transaction and they have proudly indicted these people because they have had sufficient evidences for example Mr George Xiao and his LXE solar company.
Then it is reasonably to said that seychelles judicial system would be able to deliver free and fair justic for crimes committed in the seychelles and evidences would not be difficult to find i suppose.
Remember as the famous proverb goes
On the issue of Jean-Paul Adam as a potential leader of the SPPF. Me personally i do not see any problem with that because this is your views and i respect it. And you know his potentials have work close to him.
If he has the right credentials why not.
What i have so far find it difficult to comprend are as follows?
Being abroad it seems that you are well aware of what goes on in the SPPF camp. Why? Because as a person who reside in the seychelles i have never seen anything that Jean-Paul has displayed publicly which proves that he is a potentail leader.
What i do know through the gravevine on this blog that he is a speech writer for your better evil and he is officially the secretary of state in the Michel administration.
After all you rebuke Mr Gill on the issue on a good speech writing speeches for the president claiming that he is doing his job.
Apart from these things nothing spectacular politically as far as i know through the SBC or the Nation.
For a person who lives abroad with so much informations and who is more than willing to criticise the SPPF past leaderships but who firmly believes with conviction that justic is not good for them. This i have found it mind boggling and this is unlike an SPPF supporter who stays abroad.
I firmly believed that seychellois who is interested in politics ,stays abroad and who has an open mind would percieve politics in the seychelles differently.
Please my dear friend be real because i am very much convince that you are physically residing in the seychelles althought your spirit reside abroad and most probably you work within the SPPF apparatus in the state house.
Thank for giving us these informations from the source itself.
Have a nice day.
From a seychellois
patrick x is twisted and perverted like JP.Adam.
ReplyDeleteAdam thinks that he can arse lick Michel to retirement and jump start- overrun Danny Fuare as the next P.P. candidate.
Then he thinks he can get the Opposition to agree to a coalition government.
Unfortunately for JP. Adam, Danny Faure will kick his butt out of town using Rene's soldiers at Barbaron.
As Adam tries to wind Michel out of depression to get him to retire and past the post of presidency to him, remember, Seychellois do not like self professed "Arse Lickers" as President, we have our dignity, and we will take it back from you SPPF- P.P. communist, capitalist criminal organization that has bankrupted Seychelles.
Posted By:
Christopher Gill
P.S. P.P. Use your name you " Arse lickers" that you are!
Thank you, have a nice day of course!
To prosecute any SPPF/PL leader, surely there needs to be a party other than SPPF/PL in power. Michel does not need to prosecute any of its leaders to win any election.
ReplyDeleteSeychellois, whislt i admire your optimism i am unsure as on what you are basing yourself for a possible win for the Opposition in 2011? The SPPF/PL does not play fair and it never will. So do not bet on level playing field from them.
However despite the unlevel field, Ramkalawan in 2006 for sometime looked as if he was going to win (and that despite the field) however Ramkalawan in 2006 benefited from a unified opposition (and had not commited the many faux pas he has since then)!! So defeating the SPPF/PL is possible if we can reconstruct and make better the conditions existed just prior to 2006. If that is possible is moot point!
Some of you may know the true identity of Patrick X (i have not the faintest idea nor does it matter) but i consider it immaterial as who is. But i wish only that we pause on the petty name callings and petty accusations!
Seychellois, i will have to disagree with you when you say that it will be possible to work with some SPPF/Leaders. I wish that you could elaborate as who (i do not think this is a problem since they are politicians/in the public eye in any case)those SPPF/PL leaders are?
I personally think that by associating (i am excluding here public servants) with the SPPF/PL is severly compromise the ability to do good. By their actions the SPPF/PL have shown that they are unable to do what is good for Seychelles as opposed to what is good for them and stay in power. Mr Gill has first hand knowledge and experience in the way the SPPF/PL operates.
I do not see the SPPF/PL now or in the future in a coalition. IF they were so weak as to require a coalition, then i would be for finishing them off (in the sense of taking them out of power) rather than give them a life line to continue do harm to the country!
As for Patrick X comments about the SNP through their inaction is assisting the SPPF/PL to stay in power, i can only say that be it by design or accident the present situation the SNP finds itself in, is not inspiring me that they will be able to win the next elections!
Vox Dei
I can see that Gill is again reverting to his true self by publically calling people petty names and showing agression that would make France Albert Rene proud. By doing so Chris you have already lost the debate. Will you treat your political opponents withthe same disrespect the day you reach State House? If so then God help all freedom loving Seychellois.
ReplyDeleteTo Seychellois:
If all you're interested in is being to smoke cannabis with your friends without risking jail all I can say to you is to grow up. I don't know what grade you're in, but frm the sound of it you're about the same level as Chris Gill's writings, i.e 9th grade.
The likes of you want to run the country and you wonder why I say I'd vote the evil that I know?
Patrick X
Vox Dei:
ReplyDeleteThe PL certainly do not need any assistance in form of alliance with other parties to stay in power. The only support they need is in form of votes and that they already have enough of. They are otherwise well organized and work from the grassroots and upwards in contrary to the OP who work from the top and stop halfway down the line. They have control of the SBC, Nation and have more funds to run their campaign. Michel has also something else that neither Ramkalawan, Volcere or Gill has a gram of: charisma. The latter does believe it or not help get votes.
I sincerely believe that SNP(or rather Ramkalawan himself) is actively helping PL stay in power, not because he wants to, but because he is forced to. There is something the PL has on him and I dare say that he is nailed and can hence do nothign else than comply. Besides, the SNP is required to fulfill our Constitution. I'm sure Chris can tell us all which part I'm talking about.
http://www.cmseducation.org/wconsts/seychelles.html
No Seychellois, I'm no expert, but you'll be amazed how much info one can read oneself to if one bothers to make the effort.
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteI have already told you
If you are reffering to me as a 9 grader for my open minded analyses. I thank you for that because i do not claim to know all and i am learning. May god bless this year i will be in grade 10.
If you are referring to some of the grammatical errors in my comment. I would urge you to go back and read your own comments on this blog and come up with your own conclusion.
I am sorry to tell go that my opinions on this blog is my own and it is not motivated by a burning ambition to be with SPPF elitists and to be controlled psychologically by them. And not by any political parties for that matter.
To let you know i do not do drugs and i do not condone it. Please read my comment carefully because you are not getting the real essence of it.
I am too young to testify on the issue of drugs in the seychelles. Please since you are in the SPPF circle ask Mr Rene your questions pertaining to the history of drugs in the seychelles. If you are in his good book he will tell you and then you can educate the 9 grade student on this blog like me.
I would rather be a 9 grade student who thinks independently rather than a genius who just glorify failures.
As far as i am concerned to me your name is Patrick X and that is it. I will not lower myself by using non-sensical arguments which will torment my good conscience because i have distorted facts to make another man looks good.
To Vox
I can tell you honestly i am not in favour of any coalition with the SPPF and that i have explicitly stated in my comments.
What i did is to open up the forum on this issue to force Patrick X to come up with a name in the SPPF rank?
I am very happy he did and he came up with the name of Jean-paul Adam. The relative of the Savy royal family and since then Mr Gill has answered him back on this issue on Jean-Paul Adam.
So i can tell you that we are on the same wavelenght on the issue of coalition.
Remember to make our forum interested we have to open the debate by asking or provoking probing questions.
From a seychellois
Seychellois, sorry to compare you to a ninth grader, but when your only concern is to be able to smoke weed with your mates without getting a smack from the law, I dare say you have the mentality of a 9th grader. I do not correct others for their spelling errors or degrade them for it. That I leave to others, for instance those who know wether it's called 'advise' or 'advice'.
ReplyDeleteAs to coalition of any sort in Seychelles I stand my stand by saying that it surely will lead to collision as it is no short cut to victory. Only hard work can achieve that. Question is: Who is willing to work for it?
I recieved a mail today where the sender suggested that a new party was created, one that would fight for the Seychellois so that they can be equal with the expats regarding salary and general rights. The mail was very simple, but said a lot about what occupies the minds of the average man. It seems however that everyone has forgotten about the man on the street. Have you?
Patrick X
Reply to Patrick X
ReplyDeleteThank for keeping the forum cordial!
I would like to clear a misunderstanding regarding the drugs issue.
This the excerpt of my comment has rightly stated if the seychelles justic system is good for petty thieves and the so called Escobars who are little drug traffickers.
Why is that same judicial system not good for the SPPF elitists. After they set the judicial system and your better evil Mr James Alix Michel told us that our judicial system is very good and impartial.
So your argument do not make sense because your better evil said so when he appointed the new chief justice.
I brought the issue of drugs which is a reality and a destructive evil ill in seychelles today to try to bring forward that we should not let bigger crime escape the judicial system for the simply reasons that the common man on the street would find it unjust.
So in other words everybody should be equal as far as justice is concerned. This is what the common man on the street is craving for because they see favouritism is the way that justice is administered in the seychelles.
It is very good indeed when brave people take initiatives to fight for other who cannot fight for themselves.
I do hope that they will recieve all the support from the ministry of employment who is rest on its laurels with their empty promises yet so far nothing has changed.
It is high time the common man is respected in his own country and by labelling us as laziness just for them to bring in their cheap labour and create a society which is dependent on welfare needs to stop.
From Seychellois
Ok Seychellois, here's something to chew on:
ReplyDeleteThe justice system of any corrupt regime will always be harsh to those at the bottom and mild to theose at the top because it is those at the top who have bought the judges, have the best lawyers and not least make the laws. Yes, our judiciary is stil suffering from Reneism, no discussions there. But, just because those at the top are dealt with with silk gloves does not mean that the hash smokers should get the same treatment. Drugs are a peril to society and anyone using or selling them should be dealt with harshly. Just for the record. Unfortunately, many at the top have been protected not by the judiciary, but by the law, ref the brother of the ex chief of Police who resigned quietly and suddenly and has been very quiet since, just like Chang Leng and other top officials who suddenly resigned without warning. Now why did they do that? Could it be someone at the top said enough was enough?
Naturally the common man on the street feels unjustice and I cannot say I blame him for feeling that, many have felt unjustice since 1977 and many will do so for a while yet to come. I do not dispute your points there, nor do I dispute your views when you say that the PL has been a party corrupt to the core although Michel has done a job cleaning up(Way Hive, Chang Leng etc). Unfortunately a 100% cleanup is not possible as it would land 80% of public servants in jail. Someone in another blog made accusations of corruption taking place in Victoria morgue where the guys working there are charging the families of the deceased kept there for many days for one day only while giving a 'discount' and pocketing it all giving the undertaker his share too mind you. Not a single person commented the accusation nor did it reach the press. Can you think why not? Simple: becasue every Seychellois is directly or indirectly part of the corruption. Please do not tell me that only PL supporters have been taking part of the morgue corruption as I'm sure all political sides have been accepting discounts there. Now come tell me the common man is not also helping corruption or favouritism as you call it.
As to the common man being respected I see him deserving the same respect any man deserves in his own country, even an expat who has been given employment. What kills me is that certain jobs are solely given to expats and when employers are asked why Seyhellois are not given those jobs the answer is simply 'because they are too lazy, they are rude and they show no respect to the clients'. Is that the common man that deserves respect? Unfortunately the common man wants to give cheap labour in form of as little working hours as possible, but wants a huge pay check.
Who's to blame? Albert Rene? Partly I'd say yes, he is to blame as socialism breeds parasites, nothing else. People become lazy and feed on an endlessly large system that refills itself and in the end they know nothing than free give aways. For that I despise the SPUP/SPPF and partly the PL. That parasite mentality is still very present and I see it every time I go home as I watch young people who'd rather sit do nothing than work at a hotel, fish or clean fish at IOT. The mentality is however bound to change as even the prezident has openly and publically said that we are a lazy nation who need to get off our butts. I couldn't agree more.
Now since we're in the subject of laziness, do you not blame the opposition's laziness and reluctantness to campaign for being the main reason that they simply cannot win an election? Not that it helps that their leader himself is an employer of cheap expats which he drives around in his import tax-free pickup instead of setting up an example by empoying his own countrymen. Come one Seychellois, we all want change, but few of us want to work for it.
Patrick X
Patrick X says Enough is enough and someone said time to move on for Chang Leng.
ReplyDeleteGive us a break X. Chang Leng has allegedly stole millions of dollars and has accounts overseas that have Central bank money in it.
Unless Michel prosecutes, I am sorry, enough is enough is not enough coming from Mr. President.
Michel is too coward to touch Chang Leng. Chang Leng holds too much for Michel.
Regarding Waye Hive, unless you know something I do not know, Waye Hive was a military man placed to run the Police by Michel himself.
So if he had resigned so what.
Waye Hive used unconventional means to fight crime, but he faught crime. Unless you know something I do not, enlighten us.
At least Waye Hive is a Seychellois, and today we our Police force has goneback to the colonial era, with a bunch of Irish running the show on fat salaries, house car, free gas, free trips to Europe when they are home sick. This is a national disgrace, to recruit incompetent Irish from Ireland to run the Police Force in Seychelles. What message do we send to our people?
Michel has reduced Seychelles to colonial status. He has made being a Seychellois worth nothing to us.
We are paid less for being a Seychellois!
There is no excuse for that, it is only a reflection of his incompetence as a leader.
Christopher Gill
Chris:
ReplyDeleteWay Hive's brother is a known Escobar putting his brother in a difficult situation. He may hav fought crime, but can you imagine the dilemma, the looking the other way and the continuos choice between blood and water? Which one is thicker for you?
In the end he got an 'enough is enough' from James Michel who despite his own skeletons has to walk a fine line and show action, but at the same time having difficult choices regarding who to show that action to. Remember that Michel is a politician who needs his allies, yes even crooked ones.
Now see it from another side: Let us say that Michel let the cat out of the bag and all hell broke loose when the IMF discovers how really corrupt we are. Do you think we'd be getting the help we're getting now?
Now put yourself in Michel's seat and you discover that 80% of your top officials are corrupt to the bone. Which ones would you give the boot? Michel has through the years under Rene also had to look aside, even aside his own self, and now after winning the election with a 54% majority you expect him to tell his voters that he's been haiving them on? Get real mate.
Look, I'm not saying that Michel is pure as snow, on the contrary, but do understand things from his point of view and have the sense to realize that the clean-up process that's needed will take time, lots of it. How would you for instance act if you had the power to imprison your closest allies due to corruption? Would you do it or would you give them the choice of resigning quietly to save your own butt?
You'd do the same Chris, the very same. You proved that the day you crossed the floor and joined the enemy. And you'll do it again by coming up with some crap about it being in the best interest for Seychelles.
Patrick X
Hi Everyone,
ReplyDeleteIs anyone else besides me getting sick and tired of the same broken record that is coming from PX?
My God man, we know you are trying to "act" like you are creating a debate here, but you are so predictable.
Take another approach, please! Show us some originality, because you are making this site (which I had hoped would be a platform to get the murderers out of office) not as interesting anymore.
Or have you been nominated as the official devil's advocate. Do you even have a job beside the one related to this site? It seems to me that where it takes other bloggers a while to reply to comments, you do it on a regular basis. I’ve even noticed you do it 3 times a day. Mix it up a bit please, so that we know you have a life outside this site like we do.For your sake. You even blogged on Xmas and New Years day! What kind of life is that? Unless you don’t have one, besides telling people what should be done in Seychelles, when you yourself have once said that you are not in Seychelles. Looking from the outside in are we? It’s easy to critique when you are in that position.
BTW, I don’t believe you live overseas. It's easy to read between your lines.
You appear to be educated and you seem to be playing sides.
At the end of the day, you are on this blog to only create confusion, trying to entice people to reply to your comments. In fact, I even writing to you means you assume are succeeding in a way….hahaha…. But I know what I’m doing and you can’t fool me.
Stop playing mind games.
Voice your opinion, say what you want to say, as we tolerate a difference of opinion - but, damn, you are beginning to sound unoriginal. We’ve heard all the pro-SPPF/PL lies for many years now. Tell us something new. Bring value.
What happened in your life for you to see things this way?
Here's to a great 2010 and to you dreaming yourself as the President one day. I say that because you seem to have all the answers...and Michel doesn't.
Haha…... What a joke.
Cheers,
B
P.S. Now you can reply and start being diplomatic/smart, say things about me personally attacking you or even choose not to reply, so that others can see that you are mature and professional.
Go ahead and do it.
What’s new?
Man you are boring.
Ooops, was I personal again? : )
Did I give in to you trying to create debate and confusion again ?…hahaha..
How sad.
Happy New Year!
In reply to B:
ReplyDeleteI must say that nobody seems to be tired of that record you say I'm playing as they keep on replying and posting their views creating exactly what I want: a debate. What astonishes me, and confirms my points, are all the attacks on me and all your paranoid accusations about me being a paid advocate for the PL.
I can tell you all one thing though and that is by acting the way you do, i.e with personal attacks and insults, you have already proved that you are no better than the SPPF/PL was back in the days of Rene. By attacking every opponent you show the same disgusting disrespect as the SPPF did and you are little tolerant to opposition, just like the SPPF/PL.
To get those murderers out of office you must realize that it has to be done through the ballot box, not through a coup and most certainly not through agreeing with oneanother on a blog whilst nodding your heads saying 'wey man, sa en bann kouyon sa' whilst those very kouyon prevail in staying in power time after time after time. To get those murderers out of office you must come up with a better alternative the people can rely on. So far you lot havn't been able to prove that. Why? Well, I've already told you that and since you're not fond of scratched records I won't bother.
You can believe what you want regarding my location and occupation and speculate till your eyes pop out. Actually I am quite amused by your speculations as it clearly shows gross paranoia amongst you all. That same paranoia was used excercised on the Seychellois by Rene in his early days, only his was also based on superstition. Doc Devalier used the same on the Haitians in hos days, only he used the Tonton Macoute to really freak them out. I am using Patrick X to freak the lot of you out and so far it's been working well. By the way, that's a load of bull, I'm here to debate. ;-)
I am not playing mind games B, and if I was I was hoping the lot of you would have enough intelligence, and balls, to play along and go for gold. Instead you all run around like a bunch of chickens who have just had their heads cut off, bumping into eachother and have no idea what hit them. Seriously guys, if you think I'm playing mind games, just wait till Michel's propaganda machine starts playing its mind games. I am preparing you for what's to come in the 2011campaign and I must say that had there been an exam today you would have all failed miserably.
I accept your 'toast' to a great 2010 B, but if you really think I'm aiming for president then you obviously have no clue of who I am. None whatsoever. But I will reply to every post that challenges me and my opinion as it is through replies that debates are made. Wether or not I'm boring is irrelevant, but what is relevant is that I have caught all your attention here and obviously deeply offended your egos by saying that you(the opposition) is as of today not a worthy alternative to the PL. Had I said I was a sworn PL supporter I think you would have accepted me as a lost case, but I'm not. I have alweays despised of the SPUP/SPPF/PL, but see them as a better alternative than the rest(whatever is left of them).
Start acting like men insterad of adolescants and you might earn the trust of the Seychellois people.
Patrick X
Sometimes i wonder (and now i wait for Mr Gill to correct if i am wrong) if we can really take the Opposition seriously and that for the followin.
ReplyDeleteThis week commenced an exercise to check and registrater names on the electoral list. A cleaner at my workplace confided in me that her SPPF/PL branch officer had collected her identity card to check her name on the register.
We all know that there is a possibility of SPPF/PL calling a snap election, and our opposition does not even bother 1. to advertise in terms of a Vizyon or some other newsletter publication of the importance for all (espcially opposition supporters) to ensure their name is on the register or 2. put in place some mechanism to ensure check and registration.
However what is most important for the SNP during this time is recreational time (disguised as campaign) on the island of La Digue, where emphasis was drink and make merry.
The difference between the approach of the SPPF/PL and the SNP/DP/Opposition is towards the voters list is evident, and then we wonder why SPPF/PL wins elections.
I checked my name and it is still on the register. There is not more than 20 votes that separated the SPPF/PL and the SNP in the last Nat Assembly elections. Suffice that a few Opposition supporters do not appear on the register to carry this district for the SPPF/PL in the next elections!
Zor serye zot en pe!!
Vox Dei
Vox Dei, can you tell me what the requirements are to be on the list? I honestly don't know.
ReplyDeleteWe all know that one has to be Seychellois(national) and have lived in the country for a minumum og 6 months(I believe), but how can one be sure that all Seychellois passport holders living abroad for years do not have their ID used in the election? Let's try a little thought experiment:
A Seychellois moves abroad in his/her early years by simply flying out and staying there. The person is still Seychellois, but does not reside in Seychelles. The election comes up and his/her ID is used on the electoral list. An authentic false ID card/passport is issued(we've seen that before, ref Radovan Krejcir) to a random person that fits the age, gender etc(naturally a loyal supporter) and the person goes and votes for the PL with "authentic false" ID. It doesn't however need to be done that complicated as there are many alternative ways to
Not that I'm accusing the PL of being so dodgy, but an interesting thought experiment don't you think? After all, the electoral comissioner is a loyal servant to the bone, they refuse to deal out the electoral list electronically and they have 100% control of the department of immigration where passports are issued.
I just wonder if the opposition would ever dare to come out with such a csse in Regar let alone even try to investigate it further. ;-)
Patrick X
X, first of all in such a tight and small community as we are electoral fraud as you have just described is almost impossible to pull off. Though i must admit that few might be possible.
ReplyDeleteThe reason being that each district has on average 2,500 voters. Election agents are supposed to know their people in each constituency. The exercise of weeding out 'false voters' (should electoral fraud be a cause for concern on the part of opposition parties) should have been done prior to the exercise organised at the begining of each year and after that exercise.
What X suggests, would be collusion between the Electoral Commisioner, and Ministry of Internal Affaris (where identity cards and passports are issued- as an aside Kreijir had a real Seychellois passport and not a fake one). I bet that the SPPF/PL have blue print/plan taking care of electoral frauds (i do not feel that they have implemented it yet, because the need does not arise.
X i am not sure what are the precise laws, but there is a requirement of nationality and residency to figure on the electoral list. This is checked by the electoral commisioner office. I remember a few years ago, i was at a friend's house one day who had just changed house and consequently wanted to change its name on the district registry, a Mr Johny Souris from electoral commisioner officer came to check that he was actually residening in that place.
Going back to fraud, on voting day there are several safeguards to prevent a person voting twice, the ink and invisible ray on the hands. Plus the names and id is called out and the polling agent ticks the name down, like said before a polling agent worthy of the name would know almost everbody on the list. If the Opposition had strong structures at district level, the possibility of electoral fraud would be neutralised, because before election the parties would have combed throught the list.
The question that begs is whether the voter list is credible? I am tempted to say that it is because the Opposition is not saying that it is not!
Vox Dei
Thanks for the clarification Vox Dei, I appreciate it as it gave me great relief and not least belief that at least our election is credible. It is however as I claim theoretically possible, but as you say it is also difficult to pull off as everyone knows everyone else pretty much.
ReplyDeleteBut as to 'authentic false' passports I disagree with you because in addition to having a proper Seychelles Passport in the name of Radovan Krejcir, he also had an 'authentic fake' passport in the name of Jules Egbert Savy which he travelled on.
I call it an authentic fake passport as it was indeed an authentic passport issued by Immigration, but issued in the name of a non-existing person. Nobody has been able to verify wether or not there is a real Jules Egbert Savy or if there ever was one. My guess is that a real J.E. Savy would have been the same age as Krejcir, but died as a child or adolescant hence is forgotten. He could well also be a Seychellois like myself living abroad for long, i.e still registered, a citizen asking for a passport. No suspicions whatsoever and there would not have been either had he not got caught.
Now if such can occur, is it so unthinkable that false IDs can be issued to be used to vote with? Is there no voting elsewhere thatn at the districts, for instance a place where the govt can control 100%? After all 4% majority of lets say 60.000 people(legible voters)is a mere 2.400 people. I would love to know if my name was on the electoral list.
I just can't understand why the opposition can't be bothered to check the list. Too much effort I guess, either that or they simply do not know how to handle it. The value of doing good research is obviously not something they appreciate.
Maybe some of my critics here can tell me why.
Patrick X
Hi Pat, and hi Seychellois
ReplyDeleteFor once, i will defend Pat. I find his thinking to be selfish at times, but Seychellois, in one of your attacks on him, you attacked a larger group. My response is not of a political nature, just defending something i believe in. Seychellois said
"From my personal experiences JJ spirit could not be a good spirit since its founders are atheist."
As an atheist, i am angered by this way of thinking. While the founders of JJ spirit might be wicked or saintly- it cannot be because of their atheism, as atheism does no in any way endorse evil.
Atheism endorses logic, and it accepts morality as a human trait. In many ways, atheists are more likely to be 'be good for goodness's sake', true goodness, as they don't do good hoping for paradise. They do it knowing that it is simply what they want to do. On the other hand, they can do bad too.
But is is shameful for you to to insinuate that atheists are evil because they don't beieve in god. What came first, faith or God?
So Pat, for once i stand up for you.
I still believe you are selling yourself short by trusting in words that empower the strong, and dig cavernous holes under our little people. Yes Pat, This government only seeks to look good, and this image they present is the only one they see.
In some of our schools, poor little kids sit on chairs with three legs, some with two legs, balanced againat a wall. Windows are missing and walls are smeared with the dirt of years. The floors look bombed, and some kids sit on bricks. Do you care about this?Because PP Pl does not care. We are told we have 98% literacy rate as 98% of our population has been through the school system, but do you call a student who can only get 5% in maths, 12% in English at the END of S5 literate? This happens to hundreds of our kids each year.
Love Ya Pat
All the best in 2010
Zaklen Zoulou
Hello Zaklen Zoulou,
ReplyDeleteThanks for your opinion and comments, very much appreciated from a seflish atheist bastard like myself. ;-) But on a serious note, I've seen a lot of crap in my 30 odd years and I'm not so sure what creates evil(at least what we define as evil). Good is however created from the heart, no doubt about that and if you don't have that in you it is simply not possible to create good.
I was confrionted by a religious couple on my way to work once, the were some kind of Pentecost/Evangelical group, the type that recruits members at train stations or outside soup kitchens. The fellow pulled out his bible and started his recruitment by asking me if I believed in God and upon replying a polite 'no' he asked me if I would like to join one of their meetings. I told the fellow that I am a non believer, but have a philosophy that I try to do at least one good deed every day be it help an old lady over the road, help a colleague out, help a friend or simply encourage someone who's down by giving a warm smile of hope. He looked at me as he closed his bible and said 'Sir, I think that you have a good attitude and are a good person. God bless you and have a nice day'. I still live by my philosophy which annoys the hell out of my wife at times, but I believe in it and practice it not because I feel I might get my reward in heaven if I should find that there is such a thing the day I die, but because I want to and it makes me feel good. No faith in God, but I have faith in people, even those who may seem evil at times.
We must remember that the government are politicians and by being just that their sole goal is to get power and keep it. Power corrupts the mind and once gained it wakes our most primal instincts and turns us back to what we were before civilisation made its entry along the banks of the Tigris and Eufrates. Trust me, I've seen so-called good guys turn to ruthless traitors once they gained power. We only have to look as far as Rene who did a radical change after taking power, not gaining it as some would say. But again, by taking power he became the hero of many and still is as taking power is one of our primal instincts. Gaining power is something we're taught to do and live by.
cont...
cont...
ReplyDeleteAfter the crunch we had last year we will pretty much spend the next decades repaying our debts and everyone will suffer in one way or another. Those with plenty will suffer in their way by for for instance have to cut down on things like air-con(however ridiculous it may sound) whilst those with little will have to suffer like for instance not getign milk every day. The public sector will however be the great losers as saving money there will affect for example the school kid with a 2-legged chair or the science class with a fully equipped lab, but no chemicls to experiment with. Sad and totally unjustifiable, but alas that is the hard reality of modern day social democracy. I've been to the world's richest and poorest countries and have seen that the public sector is always the one to suffer. I've seen schools in one of Europe's richest countries where the maintenance is so bad that the environment is unhealthy for humans(air quality).
About the students with bad scores I cannot elaborate more as I don't know their story and there could be many factors that have had negative effect on their learning. I can't say it's the kids' or teacher's or parents' fault for that matter, but if a kid's grades are so bad by S5 then I believe that there is need for some psychological help. Not that the kid is stupid in any way, but more likely to be troubled by something, moslt likely something domestic. You know, in the old days a 'bad' student was said to be 'kouyon' or 'bet' or even worse 'abriti' and we Seychellois are not exactly known to be good at bringing up unpleasant subjects are we? The kid could have bad eyesight, bad hearing or simply suffer from dyslexi.
One of my best friends was told that he lacked the intelligence to study anything advanced and was advised to become an electrician as it was an easy trade to learn. He did, became a danm good one too. Some years later he underwent tests that clearly showed dyslexia. After getting professional help he managed to advance and now, at my age(mid 30s), he the sales manager of one of the coutry's biggest electrical grossists, and we're talking a European country! How's that for 'abriti'? We as a young nation, have just about started to see the significance of psychological help, but it takes time to get it all efficient.
We have a long way to go Zaklen, a very long way and all the help is needed now to drag the load. I think that a lot of Seychellois living abroad could conrtibute a great deal in puling the load, but getting them home is a load to pull itself. Despite all the patriotism, many have obligations in their respective domiciles be those kids, foreign spouses or even businesses. I am one of those with obligations I cannot abandon at this moment. Sorry to put Seychelles aside, but I simply cannot however much I'd love to.
Cheers, hope all your questions were answered.
Patrick X
Patrick X, i did not say the election is credible, i only aid the electoral list is credible. I am here distinguishing between the process leading to an election and the actual balloting itself.
ReplyDeleteI rememeber however that some election ago, the SNP came up with some irregularities in the balloting (i have forgotten what) but this (as many things they do) was never pursued, nor was a case brought before the courts (for whatever it is worth)!
There many things wrong with the process (but that falls within the realm of abuses commited by the ruling party, no matter how many laws would prevent that happening, by that i am referring to one of stroke of "genius" Rene came up with at start of party politics which is the so called cooling off period, where in fact it is the most important time that the SPPF campaigns, or abuse of the SBC.
But i do not think any of those abuses are fatal to the Opposition.
Vox
Ok Vox, thanks for the clarifiction. I still believe my theory is possible or a combination of it and another means of fraud. Hendricks is no idiot and being a sworn supporter of the regime he will do whatever it takes to secure victory, at least help it, for instance not giving out the list electronically.
ReplyDeleteBut no, those abuses are not fatal to the opposition. The only thing fatal to the opposition is the opposition's lack of devotion and hard work.
Patrick X
Can anyone confirm if it is true that Shiek Kalifa UAE is building a multi storey building at La Misere?
ReplyDeleteMy cousin mentioned it to me in a party and I could not believe it.
JP
London
JP, yes the Sheik is building a mansion at La Misere at an ex tracking station facility. In fact the structure is so massive that it can be spotted miles by anyone coming in by sea, and at various other points on Mahe. The lights up there are so hard that it apparently hits the water near Ste Anne/Cerf Island at night! REGAR reported that plans are not available at the Planning Authority and since it is above sky line i am unsure if it causes any problem for planes or ships!
ReplyDeleteReferring to a point i mentioned above, it was reported by REGAR this week that Bernard Georges has won 2 cases for his constituents with regards to names appearing in a wrong district area and one case not appearing at all. I do not know the facts of the case by one of the guys was awarded Rs 10,000 ruppees as damages. I guess now a vote is worth that much.
Whilst i applaud Georges initiative and tenacity, i am unsure if those where the only 2 cases or there are more. The article mentioned that such errors were material in borderline districts especially Les Mamelles (Georges district which he won by 4 votes only). Which makes me wonder if an exercise by the Oppositon parties as to check the registers (in January when register is opened and after it is certified)!
However i know that the
Electoral Com makes available only hard copies, but surely this cannot be too great an impediment.
Whilst in any democratic country the Electoral Com would have resigned as a result of the court case, here it is extremely unlikely that he does so.
Vox
No plans at Planning Dept? Sounds like the Sheik is performing the old case of 'lalwa Sadaman' on our islands. The only thing I can think of regarding such a building is an embassy where they pretty much can get away with anything. Again this is a fine opportunity for the opposition to us to prove how bent and corrupt the ruling system is. Let's see if they lift a finger apart from posting it in Regar.
ReplyDeleteVox, election comissioner resigning? That will never happen as long as he is the loyal dog he is.
Anonymous, corruption exists in the Govt and in the Opposition. There are allegations that some politician including those in the Opposition got kickbacks from a wealthy Indian Entrepreneur some time back (except for Christopher Gill ;)), one was stupid enough to allow bank transfer and the SPPF/PL got hold of this evidence and is being used to "kraz son grenn"!! So i will not be surprised if that a few crumbs here and there from the Sheik does wonders. Then again what can the Leader of the Opposition do, other than ask a PNQ on that matter?
ReplyDeleteThank you.
ReplyDeleteMy cousin says that Sheik Kalifa gets preferred treatment and he brings in plane loads of construction material, not subject to customs payments or inspection. He take his things from the airport to the construction site.
Is that true? Would James Michel allow that?
Would Michel really lick arab arse like that? I heard he even removed our beloved cocodemer stamp on passports.
Is that true? I cannot believe that this is true.
Can someone in his office at State House advise me on this?
JP
London
Interesting indeed. I have always said that the PL have as much on the SNP as the SNP has on PL and now others have confirmed my suspicions. Indeed no smoke without a fire. It would explain pretty well why a LOP would be such a coward towards the ruling party as Ramkalawan is. After all, all the man does is abstaining from voting, avoiding meetings where he could say hi say and generally stay out of Michel's way. In other works he is following the 'Les JJ travay' as told to do. I am however glad to hear that Chris is not amongst the ones who recieved 'funds' from the Arabs. Now wether that was because he didn't get the chance or because he is clean is subject for speculation.
ReplyDeleteThere is else no doubt that Siva's gold dripped on many in Seychelles. Now however, after losing billions on his greedy ventures, he has had to cut himself away from for instance the famous Appolo Hospital project, another White Elephant project. Someone suggested they turned it into a hotel, but that someone must have been high on something for even making such a suggestion as the location and architecture is just as way off as it can get.
JP asked wether or not Michel would 'cleanse arab backsides' or not. The answer to that is evidentally a yes although he'd say that it was for the best of Seychelles, due to investments etc. Again it proves that we as a nation are dependent on our wealthy neighbours, not vice versa as certain die hard PLs would claim. Seriously, what money does a bunch of luxury villas leave in Seychelles? A resort yes, but small hotels like the one on Bird Island? expecially bearing in mind that only 30% of the money generated there goes through the CBS.I must however say JP, that some rumours are a bit far off, like for instance the arab that brings construction materials on a plane seems a bit too much to be true. I agree that he may send his own stuff, people etc, but by plane?
The Coco-de-Mer stamped has been rumoured to have been removed, but I cannot say for sure as I havn't been in Sez since ealry 2009. I will however ask a source who recently returned if the stamp was coco or not. Maybe Michel could have compromised by leaving the nut adding a left hand, that way the Sheik would have been happy as it would show a sign of hygene. Who knows?
Patrick X
Patrick X-
ReplyDeleteYour "Reference to Chris Gill taking SIVA money".
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ReplyDeletePatrick X
Patrick x,you are attacking mr. ramkalawan and saying he took money from an indian - siva. This is serious. If there is a bank transfer as you say, show it.
ReplyDeleteIf not, hold your piece. You cannot attack a Leader of Opposition that way.
Gill attacked Chang Leng and he proved the money was missing.
I have followed his writings in weekly and now in star, he attacks Michel for brain less ideas on running the economy and the proof is in our suffering everyday.
Go easy on the innocent.
get serious. I read your comments and you are a little smart. But you always lose the arguments mostly, even if you think you win. Crazy!
Its just like SPPF think- braintank.
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Get real, even children in primary know when they do not have flip flops for school.
Lera Rosse
Lera,
ReplyDeleteNo smoke without a fire and these 'accusations' are as stated said to be true although no evidence is shown. The same goes fo accusations towards the PL regarding money fraud and theft. No evidence, no case, just a lot of smoke.
I don't however see why it is more serious to accuse the LOP of something than accusing the prezident of something. I know the LOP is sacred to many, but why is it so hard to believe that he has not accepted funds from an 'Indian' who could be Siva as well as Ramadoss or any other of our wealthy Indians?
Don't you think the theory is possible though, i.e that the pl has him by the nuts as they have something on him? You may wonder why Chang Leng is not being pursued for his thefts right? Maybe it's because he has James Michel by the same organ that Ramkalawan is being held by.
I think if you look around you you will find that all our politicians are grabbing eachothers' nuts in one way or another. Therefore don't shake hands with any of them unless you wear gloves.
Patrick X
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